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and it hits me oh my gosh this is that

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triangle

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you know there's explanation for

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everything that occurred in the

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Rendlesham forest incident it doesn't

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involve aliens at all it was completely

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silent it comes right over our head it's

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so a classic Chinese soldier really

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standing in the clearing he turned over

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to my father and held his hand and he

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looked in his eyes and said we're not

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alone welcome to podcast UFO for our

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live show we're live every Wednesday at

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8 p.m. Eastern Standard Time on podcast

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UFO calm during the show feel free to

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participate live in our chat room and

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don't forget to like us on our very

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active Facebook page hello and welcome

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to the show

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I'm Martyn Willis your host and our

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guest for this evening is butch

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witkowski and we're going to be talking

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about UFOs in Pennsylvania and an hour

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to were actually going to be talking

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about a very interesting subject of

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human mutilations so that's going to go

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a little bit off topic sort of we don't

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know if it's off topic or not and I'll

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be telling you a little bit more about

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butch right before we introduce them and

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I want to thank all the listeners that

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support the show and if you can't

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support the show and still want to

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listen free you can always listen on

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podcast UFO comm every Wednesday night

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at 8:00 to 10:00 p.m. Eastern Standard

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Time or on the Dark Matter digital

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network that's Thursdays at 10:00 to

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midnight I want to tell everybody that I

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am completely bald and if you don't

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believe me just go to podcast UFO calm

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you'll see right there a picture of

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myself shaved and you know it's cold

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even though it's warm I have a kind of a

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cold head and you know I might I might

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keep the look I think it I think it

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actually looks pretty good but I'm proud

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to say that because of all my friends

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and all the people that listen to the

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show and some family members we have

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exceeded the goal of a thousand dollars

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and it's still growing people can still

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donate they keep it open for a while we

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had one listener in particular that

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really stepped up to the plate and I'm

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going to mention his name

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named Alan Sanderson thanks so much and

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a number of listeners there's another

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one

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Reginald I hope I can say Reggie he

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pitched in really as well and it doesn't

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matter small donations big donations

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it's all been very nicely received

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they're very excited over there at the

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it's called one mission buzz off comm

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org

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they're extremely excited because I

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exceeded my goal and everyone's really

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happy I'm real happy and I want to thank

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everyone that helped out in that and

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let's see

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Alejandro how are you doing I am good

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how are you doing great and you know

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it's good - your skype sounds perfect

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tonight the last couple of weeks we had

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trouble and somehow it's worked itself

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out glad to have you back yeah it was

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changes with the wireless internet here

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at my work and we finally got that

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worked out and it's a good thing it's

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good to be talking to you on skype again

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yeah hey do we have anything happening I

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know though it's been kind of quiet

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which is good in some ways but that in

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another way I like when things are at

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even we don't have anything alright well

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it's not just kidding

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we always got something yeah so I guess

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the first thing I'd like to talk to you

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about I don't think we talked about this

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on your show and my memory is - terrible

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- to remember did we talk about that ham

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radio case it's not boy I'll tell you

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what if I'm forgetting it and the

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listener remembers that I'll be in big

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trouble but I don't remember anything

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yeah so this is a neat case where uh Pat

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Daniels is his name he I guess has his

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own podcast on paranormal topics and

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such but he listens he's a ham radio

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enthusiast and he was listening to his

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ham radio one evening and he heard he

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was listening to transmissions between

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airliners and a control tower and he

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heard at this plane report a UFO

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sighting which is kind of exciting

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here's a quote from the web

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cite UFOs Northwest which helped with

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the investigation about what he says he

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heard he says a pilot reported seeing an

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extremely large bright object that he

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estimated a mile wide to his right the

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air traffic controller told him that he

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was looking in the direction of Nephi

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Utah apparently the air traffic

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controller told the pilot that the

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object was not detected on radar the

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object appeared to keep pace with the

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aircraft so he was excited that's what

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he's listening for but unfortunately he

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didn't record it he did go to Utah MUFON

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Erica Luke's was the director at the

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time and they did an investigation they

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went and listened to the archives of

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these these aircraft and they did find

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some archives for and figure out what

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flight it was they found out it was an

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American Airlines flight from San

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Francisco to I think it was something

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like Pennsylvania Philadelphia

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Pennsylvania and uh then they put in a

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FOIA request they also enlisted the help

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of William Puckett of UFOs Northwest

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William Puckett has a was a

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meteorologist for a while worked for the

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EPA for many years and he's worked in

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our radar and so he's helped out with

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many radar UFO cases so I they put in a

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FOIA to the FAA to get more information

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and they got they hit the mother lode

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six weeks later they got audiotapes

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tower logs and some radar data so at the

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audio did confirm that there was a

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report so in the audio which is posted

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on our site and on ufos Northwest you

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can hear the conversation and the pilot

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does say that he asked you wouldn't

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happen to know what this a bright orange

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square we're flying over is would you

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the tower said no I'm not sure is it on

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your right side and the pilot says it's

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actually directly oh off our nose right

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now it's below us what town are we next

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to and they said you're near Nephi Utah

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and the pilot said okay cool now I'll

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see what I can go find

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thank you so that's the extent of the

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conversation so unfortunately at the

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pilot doesn't mention this object you

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know following them or being a mile-wide

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or even being in the air so it gives the

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impression it could possibly be

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something on the ground however the

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researchers are pretty sure that the

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this audio was edited so parts of it

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were removed so they don't feel they

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have the full audio and then they did

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William Puckett did some look at the

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radar data and he did find off to the

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right of the object just south of Nephi

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actually just above the highway there

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highway 15 he found some unknown returns

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so it was that he also talks about how

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these returns were very erratic so kind

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of strange like the object perhaps is

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tumbling or moving strangely so a great

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case it great research to try to confirm

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that something did happen Mark Dantonio

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of MUFON took a look at the case and he

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argues that you know unfortunately the

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official story all we have is someone

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talking about something below the plane

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so there's a couple possibilities it

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could be a fire controlled fire on the

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ground which would explain what they saw

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and radar return to smoke would be the

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radar returns however investigators have

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retorted and said well that's not the

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case because we didn't see the that on

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Doppler and this isn't an area where

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they can do controlled burns another

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researcher suggested it was a perhaps a

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nearby power plant but Luke's and

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Puckett's say well I think these pilots

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having flown in this area many times

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would have known of the nuclear power

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plant so wouldn't have mistaken that for

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something strange and they're still

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trying to get more audio and a witness

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perhaps maybe even a pilot so they can

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confirm that the pilot did say you know

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it was a mile wide and this was

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something in the air because that's a

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big key and right now all we have is

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Daniels word to go on on those aspects

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out now and why would he even bother to

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pursue it if it wasn't something like

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that

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really and this orange thing on the

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ground may not have anything at all to

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do with what he had said possibly

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earlier about the mile wide thing it's

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possible although it was an orange a

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bright orange square he was explaining

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as something that was a mile wide

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according to Daniel's in what he had

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heard in fact that's the only key

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between what Daniels reportedly heard

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and what is in the audio which appears

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to confirm Daniels what he had heard on

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the transmission so that confirms that

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he heard something odd you know

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can we be certain that Daniels isn't

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mistaken somehow in his memory we can't

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say for sure and you know Daniels I've

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heard from multiple sources is a

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trustworthy person however you know in

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order for this case to really have some

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bones to really have more to it will

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need some more official verification

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that these pilots did feel that they

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were observing something peculiar that

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was in the air you know yeah that's

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that's a pretty good one right yeah it's

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a cool case I really like it I really

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like the work that was done to confirm

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and and it's surprising that the FAA got

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back so quickly with a FOIA request now

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would you think that it's possible this

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pilot would report this to NICAP um

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possible but you know it's just a

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minority of sightings that are reported

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if it was reported I think that Richard

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Haines and the other guys at and from

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what I understand one of the people who

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work with a NAR cap Tedrow I think is

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helping out or they've actually

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consulted with him on this case so and

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they haven't reported having received

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any reports on this so hmm all right

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sounds like the pilot

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kind of was asking you know do you know

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what this is they said no but there's an

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interesting you know thing is that that

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the rate the tower said is this thing

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off to your right and some people asked

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why did the the tower say that it almost

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implies that the tower was referring to

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some radar hits or something that they

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saw on radar because you know how did he

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know that whatever this was was to the

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right that's a real good point and I'd

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never heard of smoke causing any radar

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hits before but I guess it makes sense

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if it's dense enough mm-hmm yeah oh yeah

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smoke can definitely do that I guess

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their argument though is that smoke

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would also repair on Doppler and they

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did check their Doppler radar and they

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didn't see that but there's no argument

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that smoke could cause radar hits so

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among the experts oh so I guess that's

273
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that

274
00:12:15,990 --> 00:12:14,050
still a possibility but Marcus is just

275
00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:16,000
saying that this is just a possibility

276
00:12:21,810 --> 00:12:18,850
he's exploring but they'll definitely

277
00:12:23,550 --> 00:12:21,820
need on that and to prove if that was

278
00:12:27,389 --> 00:12:23,560
the case I don't need more evidence to

279
00:12:29,180 --> 00:12:27,399
that also so for instance some recording

280
00:12:31,949 --> 00:12:29,190
of a controlled burn in the area or

281
00:12:34,829 --> 00:12:31,959
something like that you know another

282
00:12:38,220 --> 00:12:34,839
thing is a lot of the UFO sightings that

283
00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:38,230
you hear about have create no hits on

284
00:12:44,460 --> 00:12:42,250
radar at all and that happens quite

285
00:12:47,430 --> 00:12:44,470
often actually which is another mystery

286
00:12:49,530 --> 00:12:47,440
within itself you know maybe of course

287
00:12:51,900 --> 00:12:49,540
if they can get here from wherever

288
00:12:53,760 --> 00:12:51,910
they're getting hear from they can

289
00:12:59,370 --> 00:12:53,770
probably be as stealth as they want to

290
00:13:02,699 --> 00:12:59,380
be which probably yeah so what else is

291
00:13:07,050 --> 00:13:02,709
happening so what else this is a story

292
00:13:11,810 --> 00:13:07,060
that Roger Marsh just sent in and posted

293
00:13:15,900 --> 00:13:11,820
at today of an event that took place in

294
00:13:18,780 --> 00:13:15,910
2014 September 12 2014 now it's an old

295
00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:18,790
case we wrote about it on September 15th

296
00:13:25,139 --> 00:13:21,610
of 2014 at open minds

297
00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:25,149
that TV but it is brought up again and

298
00:13:29,519 --> 00:13:27,490
they finally kind of have at least

299
00:13:31,949 --> 00:13:29,529
closed it it's not completely closed

300
00:13:36,810 --> 00:13:31,959
but at they've just decided to to mark

301
00:13:40,470 --> 00:13:36,820
it as an unknown this is a exciting that

302
00:13:43,860 --> 00:13:40,480
actually the story is UFO over Las Vegas

303
00:13:46,050 --> 00:13:43,870
described as moving into a mist and this

304
00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:46,060
witness recorded this video of this

305
00:13:51,810 --> 00:13:48,730
bright object that has like a mist below

306
00:13:54,680 --> 00:13:51,820
it some people described it as a beam of

307
00:13:57,269 --> 00:13:54,690
light that was headed towards the ground

308
00:13:59,819 --> 00:13:57,279
however many experts feel that this

309
00:14:04,560 --> 00:13:59,829
video which is pretty interesting uh is

310
00:14:06,180 --> 00:14:04,570
is most likely a rocket and if you you

311
00:14:07,949 --> 00:14:06,190
know we know more lately since we had

312
00:14:10,829 --> 00:14:07,959
those those really big sightings in

313
00:14:13,319 --> 00:14:10,839
California fairly recently with the

314
00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:13,329
Rockets making these extraordinary you

315
00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:17,610
know huge brightly lit orbs in the sky

316
00:14:22,949 --> 00:14:20,290
and this looks somewhat similar to that

317
00:14:25,470 --> 00:14:22,959
and that was seen across several states

318
00:14:28,889 --> 00:14:25,480
when it happened and it made a lot of

319
00:14:31,949 --> 00:14:28,899
news however what's interesting and this

320
00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:31,959
is noted in the MUFON investigation very

321
00:14:37,740 --> 00:14:35,050
well by the researcher is that the

322
00:14:40,439 --> 00:14:37,750
investigator on this case is that there

323
00:14:43,470 --> 00:14:40,449
was never any conclusion so there were

324
00:14:47,639 --> 00:14:43,480
lots of ideas about what it might have

325
00:14:50,550 --> 00:14:47,649
been and the news pursued these and such

326
00:14:52,949 --> 00:14:50,560
as Vandenberg rocket from Vandenberg a

327
00:14:56,610 --> 00:14:52,959
rocket from a test rocket from a

328
00:14:59,610 --> 00:14:56,620
submarine of the coast of California all

329
00:15:01,829 --> 00:14:59,620
of these different ideas however they

330
00:15:04,139 --> 00:15:01,839
couldn't find that those to be the case

331
00:15:07,560 --> 00:15:04,149
they talked to Vandenberg they talked to

332
00:15:10,500 --> 00:15:07,570
the on Navy and they said nope not ours

333
00:15:12,150 --> 00:15:10,510
not ours so they it was never found what

334
00:15:15,060 --> 00:15:12,160
it might be in fact when I looked at our

335
00:15:17,310 --> 00:15:15,070
story James Oberg who is a space

336
00:15:21,180 --> 00:15:17,320
journalist and a historian he writes a

337
00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:21,190
lot for NBC and and I think mostly for

338
00:15:27,569 --> 00:15:24,250
NBC but also others space.com and stuff

339
00:15:29,550 --> 00:15:27,579
like that he actually often looks at our

340
00:15:32,819 --> 00:15:29,560
stories and he said that it looked like

341
00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:32,829
a pretty standard rocket launch

342
00:15:38,999 --> 00:15:35,410
however the usual suspects

343
00:15:41,519 --> 00:15:39,009
to have alibis this time he said so uh

344
00:15:44,639 --> 00:15:41,529
we still don't know you know who it was

345
00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:44,649
where this rocket came from so it's

346
00:15:49,290 --> 00:15:46,930
still a mystery that is really strange

347
00:15:50,910 --> 00:15:49,300
you would think that it would you know

348
00:15:53,369 --> 00:15:50,920
come right up who it was

349
00:15:55,889 --> 00:15:53,379
yeah I mean it's off the coast of

350
00:15:59,999 --> 00:15:55,899
California for God's sakes I mean no one

351
00:16:03,389 --> 00:16:00,009
can like launch a rocket without having

352
00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:03,399
any oh I don't want to say you know

353
00:16:08,579 --> 00:16:06,370
record of it but no one can just plain

354
00:16:09,150 --> 00:16:08,589
launch a rocket without anyone knowing

355
00:16:13,410 --> 00:16:09,160
about it

356
00:16:15,780 --> 00:16:13,420
and unless it's the enemy yeah I have a

357
00:16:19,019 --> 00:16:15,790
feeling that you know if you and I you

358
00:16:22,769 --> 00:16:19,029
know went to San Diego let's say and

359
00:16:25,439 --> 00:16:22,779
rented a boat and you know launched a

360
00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:25,449
rocket off back of mile off the coast or

361
00:16:30,210 --> 00:16:27,850
something it would get noticed and

362
00:16:31,650 --> 00:16:30,220
they'd figure out it was us and we'd

363
00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:31,660
probably get in a little bit of trouble

364
00:16:36,119 --> 00:16:33,970
I know but I know this is a type of

365
00:16:37,980 --> 00:16:36,129
trouble I would like to get in so what

366
00:16:40,139 --> 00:16:37,990
are you doing with you yeah because now

367
00:16:42,389 --> 00:16:40,149
I have a shaved head and I'm criminal

368
00:16:44,579 --> 00:16:42,399
likely right you're one of those kind of

369
00:16:48,059 --> 00:16:44,589
you're a bad dude now you're like

370
00:16:49,829 --> 00:16:48,069
asteroids but yes so this is really

371
00:16:53,670 --> 00:16:49,839
weird I mean it could have been a top

372
00:16:57,480 --> 00:16:53,680
secret test you know and so it's kind of

373
00:17:00,960 --> 00:16:57,490
there an unacknowledged test but a test

374
00:17:03,269 --> 00:17:00,970
where the populace could see it it's a

375
00:17:04,289 --> 00:17:03,279
big mystery I think it's so strange it's

376
00:17:07,470 --> 00:17:04,299
really weird

377
00:17:09,569 --> 00:17:07,480
now did you may have said this and I may

378
00:17:10,799 --> 00:17:09,579
have just missed it where other is there

379
00:17:12,990 --> 00:17:10,809
film clips of this

380
00:17:15,559 --> 00:17:13,000
oh there's there are videos and pictures

381
00:17:18,439 --> 00:17:15,569
of this in particular

382
00:17:21,240 --> 00:17:18,449
Rogers writing about one video that

383
00:17:25,409 --> 00:17:21,250
MUFON received and they posted it on

384
00:17:29,669 --> 00:17:25,419
YouTube and it's in our story but I also

385
00:17:33,299 --> 00:17:29,679
put a link to our story on it from 2014

386
00:17:36,360 --> 00:17:33,309
and Jason McClellan had written that

387
00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:36,370
story and he has some video and other

388
00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:39,450
links to some other videos that were

389
00:17:44,510 --> 00:17:43,570
captured of this object in September

390
00:17:47,940 --> 00:17:44,520
2014

391
00:17:49,260 --> 00:17:47,950
excellent well hey thanks so much man

392
00:17:52,640 --> 00:17:49,270
it's always fun to have you

393
00:17:55,170 --> 00:17:52,650
the show hey it's my pleasure buddy

394
00:17:58,440 --> 00:17:55,180
congratulations on you know on having no

395
00:18:00,810 --> 00:17:58,450
hair magic well matching your goal you

396
00:18:03,780 --> 00:18:00,820
probably and actually you probably

397
00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:03,790
raised about a dollar per strand of hair

398
00:18:08,220 --> 00:18:05,530
cuz you really didn't have that many uh

399
00:18:09,930 --> 00:18:08,230
you know what when I saw when I saw what

400
00:18:13,970 --> 00:18:09,940
was left all the gray hair on the floor

401
00:18:17,190 --> 00:18:13,980
it really made me I felt young again

402
00:18:18,030 --> 00:18:17,200
really yeah I feel younger now well

403
00:18:22,620 --> 00:18:18,040
that's good

404
00:18:24,780 --> 00:18:22,630
villa yeah wow you sound like it when

405
00:18:27,660 --> 00:18:24,790
you say yeah now I got a little pep in

406
00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:27,670
my step yeah nice just don't go

407
00:18:31,140 --> 00:18:30,010
committing crime sir I'll try to apply a

408
00:18:33,210 --> 00:18:31,150
Harley or something

409
00:18:35,010 --> 00:18:33,220
yeah well the Harley's uh yeah it's on

410
00:18:39,240 --> 00:18:35,020
layaway but yeah I don't know I'll think

411
00:18:41,460 --> 00:18:39,250
about that but anyway thanks so much and

412
00:18:43,430 --> 00:18:41,470
alright no problem we'll be talking to

413
00:18:45,930 --> 00:18:43,440
you next week talk to you soon Betty

414
00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:45,940
alright everyone so a little bit about

415
00:18:54,330 --> 00:18:49,210
our guest butch has been an independent

416
00:18:56,150 --> 00:18:54,340
researcher since 1989 when he along with

417
00:19:00,390 --> 00:18:56,160
four other people witnessed the UFO of

418
00:19:03,690 --> 00:19:00,400
unbelievable size quietly hovering above

419
00:19:05,670 --> 00:19:03,700
a mountain in Tucson Arizona and it was

420
00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:05,680
totally silent and that's one of the

421
00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:07,690
things that you know baffled me the most

422
00:19:13,410 --> 00:19:09,610
about my own sighting is that it was

423
00:19:16,650 --> 00:19:13,420
silent it was burnt copper in color and

424
00:19:19,710 --> 00:19:16,660
at least three football fields in length

425
00:19:22,500 --> 00:19:19,720
while butch began his own investigation

426
00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:22,510
into the UFO phenomena on that very day

427
00:19:29,520 --> 00:19:27,010
he joined up MUFON in 2007 and he was

428
00:19:32,580 --> 00:19:29,530
able to dig deeper into the past in

429
00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:32,590
existing cases and pursue even more

430
00:19:37,140 --> 00:19:35,530
on-site investigations but his research

431
00:19:39,210 --> 00:19:37,150
was still lacking something and it

432
00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:39,220
wasn't getting to the crucial answers

433
00:19:45,690 --> 00:19:44,050
that he was seeking it was this time to

434
00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:45,700
go about his work in a different manner

435
00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:48,250
and after almost a year of serious

436
00:19:52,680 --> 00:19:50,890
reflection and consideration which

437
00:19:55,380 --> 00:19:52,690
started UFO research center of

438
00:19:57,300 --> 00:19:55,390
Pennsylvania in 2009 and he brought

439
00:19:59,460 --> 00:19:57,310
together some of the best like-minded

440
00:20:01,740 --> 00:19:59,470
and long time researchers he could find

441
00:20:03,230 --> 00:20:01,750
we'll talk more about that and so hang

442
00:20:37,070 --> 00:20:03,240
on just a minute we'll be right

443
00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:41,130
welcome to the show butch thanks for

444
00:20:46,500 --> 00:20:44,170
having me on thank you and this is

445
00:20:47,610 --> 00:20:46,510
another thing though sometimes that you

446
00:20:49,380 --> 00:20:47,620
know probably shouldn't bring it up at

447
00:20:52,020 --> 00:20:49,390
all but we almost didn't get this thing

448
00:20:54,420 --> 00:20:52,030
together right that's the thing about

449
00:20:57,540 --> 00:20:54,430
live shows you know anything can happen

450
00:21:01,590 --> 00:20:57,550
and my skype wasn't talking to your

451
00:21:04,070 --> 00:21:01,600
Skype and phone issues were working on

452
00:21:07,710 --> 00:21:04,080
and on and on but we did it we're here

453
00:21:11,820 --> 00:21:07,720
yeah I got that Bob that's right so

454
00:21:14,970 --> 00:21:11,830
butch I always look around for you know

455
00:21:18,150 --> 00:21:14,980
different people in the UFO field and

456
00:21:21,330 --> 00:21:18,160
your background was fascinating I

457
00:21:23,220 --> 00:21:21,340
watched a new adventure on YouTube and

458
00:21:25,590 --> 00:21:23,230
thought you'd be interesting to have in

459
00:21:27,180 --> 00:21:25,600
the show and I always like like say it

460
00:21:29,300 --> 00:21:27,190
doesn't have to be someone totally

461
00:21:32,730 --> 00:21:29,310
mainstream it's always fun to have

462
00:21:34,260 --> 00:21:32,740
different views and and it's a you know

463
00:21:37,170 --> 00:21:34,270
it's one of the reasons I love doing the

464
00:21:40,170 --> 00:21:37,180
show so let's why don't you tell the

465
00:21:42,300 --> 00:21:40,180
listener your background I just told the

466
00:21:44,370 --> 00:21:42,310
story how you got interested in UFOs but

467
00:21:47,850 --> 00:21:44,380
let's hear your your background you you

468
00:21:48,630 --> 00:21:47,860
were involved in criminal investigation

469
00:21:52,050 --> 00:21:48,640
or something like that

470
00:21:54,870 --> 00:21:52,060
law enforcement and then after the

471
00:21:56,310 --> 00:21:54,880
sighting I took an interest in trying to

472
00:21:58,830 --> 00:21:56,320
find out what I actually witnessed there

473
00:22:00,360 --> 00:21:58,840
in Tucson with others I should mention

474
00:22:01,910 --> 00:22:00,370
that every sighting I've ever had I've

475
00:22:08,250 --> 00:22:01,920
never been alone so I know I'm not crazy

476
00:22:10,380 --> 00:22:08,260
and like you said I just I was just

477
00:22:12,030 --> 00:22:10,390
needing to go about it a different way I

478
00:22:14,340 --> 00:22:12,040
wasn't getting the answers I wanted and

479
00:22:17,790 --> 00:22:14,350
after spending a small fortune on a

480
00:22:19,830 --> 00:22:17,800
library and all this other stuff that

481
00:22:21,180 --> 00:22:19,840
you need to do on the Internet and you

482
00:22:22,710 --> 00:22:21,190
know talking to people going to

483
00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:22,720
conferences and this on the other thing

484
00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:24,490
I decided to start the UFO research

485
00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:29,650
center and we started in 2009 with one

486
00:22:36,690 --> 00:22:31,690
group we now have 12 groups two in

487
00:22:42,180 --> 00:22:36,700
Europe and ten in this country Florida

488
00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:42,190
Georgia Utah Oklahoma the name a few all

489
00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:44,290
the researchers involved are all

490
00:22:49,539 --> 00:22:46,970
longtime researchers either you know

491
00:22:52,330 --> 00:22:49,549
on their own or with MUFON they

492
00:22:55,770 --> 00:22:52,340
encompass current and former police

493
00:22:58,440 --> 00:22:55,780
officers we have a federal judge we have

494
00:23:02,230 --> 00:22:58,450
photographic analysts we have

495
00:23:06,990 --> 00:23:02,240
psychiatrists we have private detectives

496
00:23:11,710 --> 00:23:07,000
we have abduction research specialists

497
00:23:13,779 --> 00:23:11,720
and we do it a little differently than

498
00:23:16,120 --> 00:23:13,789
most groups because what we try to do is

499
00:23:18,549 --> 00:23:16,130
prove that something happened or didn't

500
00:23:20,049 --> 00:23:18,559
happen forensic ly because if it didn't

501
00:23:22,149 --> 00:23:20,059
couldn't happen forensically then it

502
00:23:23,649 --> 00:23:22,159
didn't happen so if somebody tells me

503
00:23:25,930 --> 00:23:23,659
that they saw something about the trees

504
00:23:27,100 --> 00:23:25,940
at about a thousand feet and then I look

505
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:27,110
at the weather and they find out that

506
00:23:31,029 --> 00:23:28,970
there was no visibility whatsoever it

507
00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:31,039
was a blowing snowstorm you pretty much

508
00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:33,730
know it was you know it up story mm-hmm

509
00:23:42,159 --> 00:23:38,330
but when you go out and you spend a day

510
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:42,169
or two or three on a case on site and we

511
00:23:46,180 --> 00:23:43,730
have two mobile units here in the state

512
00:23:47,860 --> 00:23:46,190
they're fully equipped in fact we just

513
00:23:51,490 --> 00:23:47,870
replaced the one we got a brand spankin

514
00:23:53,529 --> 00:23:51,500
new one and they have everything in them

515
00:23:58,500 --> 00:23:53,539
from you know built-in laptops and

516
00:24:00,730 --> 00:23:58,510
Internet connections radar every type of

517
00:24:02,110 --> 00:24:00,740
investigative tool that you can need on

518
00:24:04,060 --> 00:24:02,120
the scene of anything I don't care if

519
00:24:07,330 --> 00:24:04,070
it's a paranormal event or a UFO event

520
00:24:08,620 --> 00:24:07,340
or a cryptozoology event we have all the

521
00:24:10,090 --> 00:24:08,630
equipment on there the only difference

522
00:24:12,250 --> 00:24:10,100
between the truck and East Coast on the

523
00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:12,260
east end council meeting sorry which is

524
00:24:14,529 --> 00:24:13,490
parked out in front of my place to the

525
00:24:16,870 --> 00:24:14,539
one that's out in the west end of

526
00:24:19,450 --> 00:24:16,880
Pennsylvania is that we have rappelling

527
00:24:22,419 --> 00:24:19,460
gear in this truck and that other truck

528
00:24:25,360 --> 00:24:22,429
has a dive gear because he's a certified

529
00:24:27,220 --> 00:24:25,370
diver other than that the trucks are

530
00:24:29,620 --> 00:24:27,230
equipped the same we have our own

531
00:24:33,610 --> 00:24:29,630
personal radio channel general we have

532
00:24:35,710 --> 00:24:33,620
actually have six and their regular

533
00:24:40,570 --> 00:24:35,720
everything is either military grade or

534
00:24:43,360 --> 00:24:40,580
police grade and in the units and it

535
00:24:46,270 --> 00:24:43,370
really works out very well because I can

536
00:24:48,850 --> 00:24:46,280
go well we just took a fast trip down to

537
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:48,860
Virginia to investigate some body parts

538
00:24:53,799 --> 00:24:52,250
that were found and we had everything to

539
00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:53,809
do what we have to do including take DNA

540
00:24:58,720 --> 00:24:56,450
and everything else so I mean there's

541
00:25:00,970 --> 00:24:58,730
very few groups and I would say probably

542
00:25:04,419 --> 00:25:00,980
maybe I don't think there's any up

543
00:25:07,150 --> 00:25:04,429
to do that everybody kind of does the

544
00:25:10,090 --> 00:25:07,160
old talk to the person that made the

545
00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:10,100
report some look at the area some never

546
00:25:20,620 --> 00:25:15,770
go to the area cameras we have infrared

547
00:25:23,380 --> 00:25:20,630
we have television grade video all our

548
00:25:26,620 --> 00:25:23,390
cameras are Nikon or our computers our

549
00:25:28,659 --> 00:25:26,630
Panasonic Toughbook so we have canopies

550
00:25:30,250 --> 00:25:28,669
we have tents we can set up a table with

551
00:25:32,289 --> 00:25:30,260
chairs I mean we've got everything we

552
00:25:34,330 --> 00:25:32,299
need we can go out we can actually spend

553
00:25:37,539 --> 00:25:34,340
seven days in the field without leaving

554
00:25:39,490 --> 00:25:37,549
the truck well now where does it where

555
00:25:44,020 --> 00:25:39,500
does the money come from to to get these

556
00:25:46,570 --> 00:25:44,030
babies on the road uh my pocket really

557
00:25:51,940 --> 00:25:46,580
is privately funded yes how we don't

558
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:51,950
take donations we don't we don't solicit

559
00:25:58,390 --> 00:25:54,650
any donations and I did that for a

560
00:26:00,490 --> 00:25:58,400
reason um you know once you start asking

561
00:26:01,900 --> 00:26:00,500
for donations or people you have a donor

562
00:26:04,210 --> 00:26:01,910
that's really giving you some serious

563
00:26:07,690 --> 00:26:04,220
money you're kind of beholden to

564
00:26:09,909 --> 00:26:07,700
somebody and I don't ever want that to

565
00:26:11,110 --> 00:26:09,919
be said about us that you know well the

566
00:26:12,850 --> 00:26:11,120
only reason we're agreeing with him is

567
00:26:14,260 --> 00:26:12,860
because he gave him a check for $1,000

568
00:26:17,919 --> 00:26:14,270
I'm like I don't everyone here that

569
00:26:23,250 --> 00:26:17,929
sounds like campaign contributions yeah

570
00:26:25,870 --> 00:26:23,260
so we do it on our own now we do take

571
00:26:27,010 --> 00:26:25,880
old equipment that people don't use

572
00:26:29,530 --> 00:26:27,020
anymore because we do have a couple

573
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:29,540
folks in our group that they just can't

574
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:30,890
afford to go out and buy equipment so if

575
00:26:34,870 --> 00:26:32,450
somebody wants to donate an old camera

576
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:34,880
or an old tape player or something a

577
00:26:38,970 --> 00:26:37,490
video cameras I'm like yeah we'll take

578
00:26:41,380 --> 00:26:38,980
that and send it to them

579
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:41,390
but that's feel that's the only type of

580
00:26:45,010 --> 00:26:42,770
donations we've ever taken I think we

581
00:26:47,380 --> 00:26:45,020
took two cameras and one video camera

582
00:26:49,900 --> 00:26:47,390
and I think somebody son is a bunch of

583
00:26:51,789 --> 00:26:49,910
star maps at one time so that's pretty

584
00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:51,799
much all we've ever taken and I'm really

585
00:26:56,890 --> 00:26:54,890
not really not into that I mean there's

586
00:26:58,600 --> 00:26:56,900
always there's always bad vibes with

587
00:27:01,780 --> 00:26:58,610
that and I just don't want to get

588
00:27:03,250 --> 00:27:01,790
involved in that drama yeah okay now if

589
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:03,260
anyone wants to call and I do believe

590
00:27:06,970 --> 00:27:05,330
our phone is working you can call and

591
00:27:09,430 --> 00:27:06,980
ask the gas a question if you're

592
00:27:11,500 --> 00:27:09,440
listening live you can jump excuse me

593
00:27:13,630 --> 00:27:11,510
jump in the chat room as well and ask a

594
00:27:14,749 --> 00:27:13,640
question the phone number is six oh

595
00:27:20,419 --> 00:27:14,759
three nine six

596
00:27:22,759 --> 00:27:20,429
7:4 o3o where do you get your your calls

597
00:27:26,589 --> 00:27:22,769
on how does someone get ahold of you

598
00:27:29,709 --> 00:27:26,599
that has witnessed something we have a

599
00:27:34,969 --> 00:27:33,529
WWF or Capcom and there's a contact

600
00:27:37,549 --> 00:27:34,979
thing at the bottom of the page where

601
00:27:40,849 --> 00:27:37,559
they can send in their report or if they

602
00:27:43,719 --> 00:27:40,859
just want information will do will will

603
00:27:46,369 --> 00:27:43,729
analyze photographs for people will

604
00:27:47,629 --> 00:27:46,379
research our databases for something

605
00:27:52,129 --> 00:27:47,639
maybe somebody's looking for from the

606
00:27:55,279 --> 00:27:52,139
past or present tell people where they

607
00:27:56,779 --> 00:27:55,289
can get stuff I mean you know we operate

608
00:27:57,589 --> 00:27:56,789
a little differently we're pretty much

609
00:28:00,919 --> 00:27:57,599
open to everybody

610
00:28:03,249 --> 00:28:00,929
we'll help anybody

611
00:28:08,059 --> 00:28:03,259
we traveled pretty much all over the

612
00:28:09,799 --> 00:28:08,069
eastern half of the country and we do

613
00:28:11,930 --> 00:28:09,809
conferences we don't charge for that we

614
00:28:15,319 --> 00:28:11,940
do a lot of speaking engagements we

615
00:28:17,449 --> 00:28:15,329
don't charge for that so it works out

616
00:28:20,930 --> 00:28:17,459
very well I mean I think that the

617
00:28:25,519 --> 00:28:20,940
group's years past got away from dealing

618
00:28:27,589 --> 00:28:25,529
with the public um except for yes you

619
00:28:30,319 --> 00:28:27,599
know you know I'm saying they they more

620
00:28:32,059 --> 00:28:30,329
or less deal with the next book they're

621
00:28:34,279 --> 00:28:32,069
going to write or the next white paper

622
00:28:37,189 --> 00:28:34,289
they're going to print and they kind of

623
00:28:39,049 --> 00:28:37,199
left that getting really involved with

624
00:28:43,369 --> 00:28:39,059
the case that kind of went by the

625
00:28:46,639 --> 00:28:43,379
wayside mm-hmm so let's let's hear it as

626
00:28:49,249 --> 00:28:46,649
situation where you have used some of

627
00:28:54,259 --> 00:28:49,259
this equipment in your your trucks and

628
00:28:59,419 --> 00:28:54,269
in trying to solve a situation well a

629
00:29:00,769 --> 00:28:59,429
lot of times they are you know the one

630
00:29:03,109 --> 00:29:00,779
let's say we're going out and we're

631
00:29:05,749 --> 00:29:03,119
going to do a star watch you know we'll

632
00:29:07,639 --> 00:29:05,759
set up canopies table get our computers

633
00:29:10,159 --> 00:29:07,649
out and set up all the cameras get the

634
00:29:13,339 --> 00:29:10,169
infrared out get the get everything out

635
00:29:15,829 --> 00:29:13,349
we need and uh that's pretty much done

636
00:29:17,419 --> 00:29:15,839
at almost everything we go to not

637
00:29:19,279 --> 00:29:17,429
solution we'll set up cameras but if we

638
00:29:23,809 --> 00:29:19,289
think that you know an individual's

639
00:29:25,940 --> 00:29:23,819
seeing something you know weekly or

640
00:29:28,460 --> 00:29:25,950
monthly or a certain time of the day or

641
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:28,470
or during a certain

642
00:29:32,060 --> 00:29:29,730
type of weather we've going on the

643
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:32,070
snowstorms already where a guy said he

644
00:29:35,330 --> 00:29:33,570
kept seeing flashing lights off in the

645
00:29:37,490 --> 00:29:35,340
distance so we went out and we sat in a

646
00:29:39,289 --> 00:29:37,500
truck and we watched and and we got our

647
00:29:42,529 --> 00:29:39,299
photographs and went in there and told

648
00:29:45,289 --> 00:29:42,539
me was watching a tower flashing red and

649
00:29:48,919 --> 00:29:45,299
you know the thing I live on top of a

650
00:29:51,620 --> 00:29:48,929
mountain in another mountain over there

651
00:29:53,659 --> 00:29:51,630
is a tower that's flashing and when it's

652
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:53,669
like snow or something like that the

653
00:29:57,529 --> 00:29:55,890
light really does carry so I totally

654
00:30:00,500 --> 00:29:57,539
understand but you would think that if

655
00:30:02,510 --> 00:30:00,510
you live there that you'd be used to

656
00:30:03,169 --> 00:30:02,520
that yeah and the guy lived there for

657
00:30:06,110 --> 00:30:03,179
like 30 years

658
00:30:07,250 --> 00:30:06,120
Oh either he really wasn't paying

659
00:30:10,580 --> 00:30:07,260
attention or he never looked in that

660
00:30:12,169 --> 00:30:10,590
direction before uh we've recently uh we

661
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:12,179
have a lot of sightings right now a lot

662
00:30:16,549 --> 00:30:14,250
of reports not sightings but reports in

663
00:30:18,770 --> 00:30:16,559
Pennsylvania of a cryptid type of

664
00:30:21,350 --> 00:30:18,780
creature that we've already had one

665
00:30:23,090 --> 00:30:21,360
expedition we got three four five six

666
00:30:24,470 --> 00:30:23,100
more scheduled in different parts of PA

667
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:24,480
most of them are occurring in central

668
00:30:30,529 --> 00:30:26,610
Pennsylvania of people seeing this

669
00:30:34,190 --> 00:30:30,539
unknown creature of sorts and what we

670
00:30:38,390 --> 00:30:34,200
went out there their technology was beat

671
00:30:40,460 --> 00:30:38,400
because the woods were so thick that I

672
00:30:41,060 --> 00:30:40,470
had one of my guys walk in five steps I

673
00:30:43,100 --> 00:30:41,070
lost him

674
00:30:44,330 --> 00:30:43,110
so cameras would have been useless so it

675
00:30:47,450 --> 00:30:44,340
was just one of those sit for a couple

676
00:30:48,620 --> 00:30:47,460
days and listen and see if we could pick

677
00:30:49,940 --> 00:30:48,630
up anything that way and we walked

678
00:30:51,770 --> 00:30:49,950
around with thermal imaging devices

679
00:30:55,159 --> 00:30:51,780
which we have on the trucks and the

680
00:30:56,870 --> 00:30:55,169
thermal cameras picked up nothing so but

681
00:30:59,750 --> 00:30:56,880
that kind of strange being I was in the

682
00:31:03,680 --> 00:30:59,760
middle of 4,500 acres of prime game land

683
00:31:05,419 --> 00:31:03,690
I'm just teething with animals and we

684
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:05,429
heard nothing saw nothing didn't hear

685
00:31:09,110 --> 00:31:07,530
one sound had nothing recorded on any of

686
00:31:12,289 --> 00:31:09,120
the cameras that we did have up like the

687
00:31:13,940 --> 00:31:12,299
GoPros and stuff yeah so now we went a

688
00:31:15,770 --> 00:31:13,950
little different this time we got we

689
00:31:17,750 --> 00:31:15,780
just got cameras and two new cameras

690
00:31:20,289 --> 00:31:17,760
there surveillance cameras and they'll

691
00:31:23,029 --> 00:31:20,299
take a photograph every half second and

692
00:31:25,250 --> 00:31:23,039
they cover 150 degree angle

693
00:31:27,980 --> 00:31:25,260
wide-angle so with two of those we

694
00:31:29,980 --> 00:31:27,990
should be able to pick up pretty large

695
00:31:33,669 --> 00:31:29,990
piece of real estate and photograph it

696
00:31:36,830 --> 00:31:33,679
now I heard Stan talking to Stan Gordon

697
00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:36,840
and there's a you know he was saying how

698
00:31:41,900 --> 00:31:39,210
many different like cryptic things are

699
00:31:45,620 --> 00:31:41,910
going on in Pennsylvania and this

700
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:45,630
one particular person that was reporting

701
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:48,450
this unusual I think that's what you

702
00:31:54,260 --> 00:31:51,330
used what can you describe what they

703
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:54,270
thought they were seeing oh well they

704
00:31:58,070 --> 00:31:55,890
all every every report we have everybody

705
00:31:59,660 --> 00:31:58,080
describes the same thing uh we don't

706
00:32:01,340 --> 00:31:59,670
have anybody that veers off from this

707
00:32:05,770 --> 00:32:01,350
original description that we started

708
00:32:09,740 --> 00:32:05,780
back in July of 2014 7 8 foot tall

709
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:09,750
massive chest muscular arms with hands

710
00:32:18,410 --> 00:32:11,250
uh

711
00:32:20,810 --> 00:32:18,420
wolf like head glowing yellow eyes and

712
00:32:24,380 --> 00:32:20,820
it stands its ground it does not run it

713
00:32:25,940 --> 00:32:24,390
does not hide and they're all saying the

714
00:32:29,210 --> 00:32:25,950
same thing and there's no way this could

715
00:32:32,450 --> 00:32:29,220
be some type of hoax nope no way these

716
00:32:33,620 --> 00:32:32,460
people have no idea and what really set

717
00:32:35,030 --> 00:32:33,630
me straight on that in the very

718
00:32:36,620 --> 00:32:35,040
beginning of the research which is in

719
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:36,630
school and in which third year now is

720
00:32:42,110 --> 00:32:40,050
the fact that I found reports exact

721
00:32:44,180 --> 00:32:42,120
reports but I could match up against the

722
00:32:47,090 --> 00:32:44,190
report that I got two month ago from

723
00:32:49,700 --> 00:32:47,100
1865 in western Pennsylvania well geez

724
00:32:52,670 --> 00:32:49,710
now um someone posted up on the message

725
00:32:53,990 --> 00:32:52,680
board the Jersey you know Jersey Devil

726
00:32:56,810 --> 00:32:54,000
does that have anything to do with this

727
00:32:58,730 --> 00:32:56,820
now totally totally different the this

728
00:33:00,820 --> 00:32:58,740
is more online so they just posted

729
00:33:05,180 --> 00:33:00,830
werewolf yeah yeah you could probably

730
00:33:10,220 --> 00:33:05,190
get it close to more of a werewolf or

731
00:33:12,470 --> 00:33:10,230
maybe a skinwalker um because you know

732
00:33:14,750 --> 00:33:12,480
like Bigfoot they hide and they they

733
00:33:16,850 --> 00:33:14,760
don't want to be seen this thing if you

734
00:33:19,250 --> 00:33:16,860
see it and like the last guy that saw

735
00:33:21,170 --> 00:33:19,260
one he was just walking in and out and

736
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:21,180
they all take place in a state park no

737
00:33:24,380 --> 00:33:22,650
place outside of a state park do we have

738
00:33:28,100 --> 00:33:24,390
any these were all taken place in

739
00:33:30,140 --> 00:33:28,110
heavily wooded areas game areas and and

740
00:33:34,810 --> 00:33:30,150
state open park areas which are very

741
00:33:37,790 --> 00:33:34,820
large parks and the last guy was

742
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:37,800
standing less than 30 feet away when he

743
00:33:42,260 --> 00:33:39,930
saw it and it never took his eyes off

744
00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:42,270
him he kept his eyes on it and he

745
00:33:47,540 --> 00:33:45,810
started backing out and it just stared

746
00:33:50,690 --> 00:33:47,550
at him it just followed him all the way

747
00:33:52,790 --> 00:33:50,700
out the trail with its eyes and I mean

748
00:33:54,989 --> 00:33:52,800
this this guy still shakes and shamblers

749
00:33:57,149 --> 00:33:54,999
when he talks to me about it so

750
00:33:59,849 --> 00:33:57,159
I can't imagine seeing something like

751
00:34:01,289 --> 00:33:59,859
you know I'm hoped I'm hoping to see

752
00:34:03,629 --> 00:34:01,299
something like that but I just don't

753
00:34:05,700 --> 00:34:03,639
really to be honest with you and your

754
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:05,710
listeners I don't have any idea what I'm

755
00:34:09,419 --> 00:34:07,330
looking at or what I'm looking for

756
00:34:11,039 --> 00:34:09,429
because number one you know there's

757
00:34:13,079 --> 00:34:11,049
protocols for investigating the

758
00:34:15,299 --> 00:34:13,089
paranormal there are protocols for

759
00:34:17,099 --> 00:34:15,309
investigating UFO sighting there's no

760
00:34:20,369 --> 00:34:17,109
protocol for investigating anything like

761
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:20,379
this right at all yeah and you know the

762
00:34:23,339 --> 00:34:22,450
indigenous population of the United

763
00:34:26,669 --> 00:34:23,349
States

764
00:34:30,089 --> 00:34:26,679
the Cherokee especially use you know the

765
00:34:33,629 --> 00:34:30,099
wolf is mostly their sightings as a wolf

766
00:34:36,899 --> 00:34:33,639
creature with their skinwalkers

767
00:34:39,180 --> 00:34:36,909
so and skinwalkers are not very nice I

768
00:34:40,950 --> 00:34:39,190
mean they're very dangerous from what

769
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:40,960
we've gathered from most folks out there

770
00:34:47,849 --> 00:34:43,210
in Oklahoma and from what we've read up

771
00:34:49,859 --> 00:34:47,859
on and you know what it is I have no

772
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:49,869
idea I'm trying to keep an open mind

773
00:34:52,829 --> 00:34:50,530
about it

774
00:34:54,059 --> 00:34:52,839
and until I get something on film which

775
00:34:57,720 --> 00:34:54,069
is probably all I'm going to be able to

776
00:35:00,180 --> 00:34:57,730
do uh I really don't even know what I'm

777
00:35:05,670 --> 00:35:00,190
looking for now is there any Native

778
00:35:08,309 --> 00:35:05,680
American of culture in that area I want

779
00:35:12,599 --> 00:35:08,319
to ask in one plane you we had no white

780
00:35:15,150 --> 00:35:12,609
men in Pennsylvania until 1754 up until

781
00:35:18,059 --> 00:35:15,160
then this was Indian Territory there

782
00:35:19,710 --> 00:35:18,069
were I believe nine tribes Susquehannock

783
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:19,720
were the biggest there were Iroquois

784
00:35:31,140 --> 00:35:29,170
mohawk satanic Delaware so the

785
00:35:33,059 --> 00:35:31,150
Susquehanna quer the biggest they were

786
00:35:40,170 --> 00:35:33,069
the warring as tribes they were war with

787
00:35:42,299 --> 00:35:40,180
everybody and you know it's so the place

788
00:35:45,299 --> 00:35:42,309
is full of burial grounds and when we

789
00:35:46,799 --> 00:35:45,309
contacted people of indigenous out in

790
00:35:50,150 --> 00:35:46,809
Oklahoma and talked to a medicine man

791
00:35:53,490 --> 00:35:50,160
and a chief they told us that you know

792
00:35:56,730 --> 00:35:53,500
being that the ground was just loaded

793
00:36:02,990 --> 00:35:56,740
with burial sites that you could be

794
00:36:06,559 --> 00:36:03,000
dealing with a skinwalker that is

795
00:36:08,790 --> 00:36:06,569
basically guarding over those sites and

796
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:08,800
he warned us right up front

797
00:36:12,420 --> 00:36:10,210
don't touch anything don't take anything

798
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:12,430
if you do find something don't take it

799
00:36:17,550 --> 00:36:15,610
legally and they sent ups they sent us

800
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:17,560
some stuff to help protect this which I

801
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:18,970
have no idea what that's all about but

802
00:36:24,930 --> 00:36:22,330
we will do what they say and only

803
00:36:26,940 --> 00:36:24,940
because I tell what to do I mean I'm

804
00:36:28,980 --> 00:36:26,950
just I'm out there throwing technology

805
00:36:33,450 --> 00:36:28,990
at something that I don't even know I'm

806
00:36:36,660 --> 00:36:33,460
thrown to that I have no idea mmm excuse

807
00:36:38,580 --> 00:36:36,670
me pardon me so we we try to stick uh

808
00:36:40,650 --> 00:36:38,590
you know this this kind of thing really

809
00:36:43,740 --> 00:36:40,660
fascinates me and we do try to stick

810
00:36:45,150 --> 00:36:43,750
more to the UFO topic because we have a

811
00:36:47,670 --> 00:36:45,160
you know a lot of people listen to the

812
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:47,680
show through that particular reason but

813
00:36:52,230 --> 00:36:50,770
I don't care if we you know spin off a

814
00:36:55,950 --> 00:36:52,240
little bit here and there on things like

815
00:36:59,880 --> 00:36:55,960
there really is interesting to me and it

816
00:37:02,960 --> 00:36:59,890
just to me it just goes along um - along

817
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:02,970
with UFOs in a way that is just another

818
00:37:09,210 --> 00:37:06,610
unexplainable you know or and and and

819
00:37:11,790 --> 00:37:09,220
like one person said to me how do we

820
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:11,800
know that it's not something from a UFO

821
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:14,290
or from a from the paranormal

822
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:18,010
right now linking the paranormal at into

823
00:37:22,350 --> 00:37:20,410
one big subject which would be ufology

824
00:37:25,730 --> 00:37:22,360
cryptozoology and of course ghost

825
00:37:28,650 --> 00:37:25,740
hunting is not so far away

826
00:37:30,150 --> 00:37:28,660
there have been paranormal events have

827
00:37:32,550 --> 00:37:30,160
taken place where lights have been seen

828
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:32,560
in the sky there have been light seeing

829
00:37:37,910 --> 00:37:34,330
the sky where something strange took

830
00:37:44,580 --> 00:37:42,170
crypto sighting or a paranormal event so

831
00:37:47,070 --> 00:37:44,590
I don't think they're that far apart

832
00:37:49,350 --> 00:37:47,080
anymore I mean at one time they had held

833
00:37:51,930 --> 00:37:49,360
their own separate little rooms but I

834
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:51,940
just don't see that anymore I mean more

835
00:37:57,240 --> 00:37:53,650
and more researchers are trying to

836
00:37:59,820 --> 00:37:57,250
connect a one with the other where I

837
00:38:01,520 --> 00:37:59,830
just read an article where a ghost town

838
00:38:04,140 --> 00:38:01,530
group that's all they do is hunt ghosts

839
00:38:05,820 --> 00:38:04,150
they are now setting up cameras facing

840
00:38:08,250 --> 00:38:05,830
the sky while they're in doing what

841
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:08,260
they're doing and they're trying to see

842
00:38:12,750 --> 00:38:10,210
if anything goes on in the place that

843
00:38:14,660 --> 00:38:12,760
they're investigating inside if

844
00:38:17,340 --> 00:38:14,670
anything's going on the sky outside

845
00:38:18,150 --> 00:38:17,350
which I thought was a pretty neat trick

846
00:38:21,150 --> 00:38:18,160
huh

847
00:38:22,620 --> 00:38:21,160
Michael excuse me one of the thing that

848
00:38:26,940 --> 00:38:22,630
I think us

849
00:38:29,430 --> 00:38:26,950
gets a little bit of a separation now I

850
00:38:30,989 --> 00:38:29,440
do realize there's a heck of a lot of

851
00:38:32,910 --> 00:38:30,999
unexplained things I've had a few things

852
00:38:34,890 --> 00:38:32,920
happen in my life that were

853
00:38:38,839 --> 00:38:34,900
unexplainable that we're really

854
00:38:42,479 --> 00:38:38,849
interesting still are but I think UFOs

855
00:38:44,670 --> 00:38:42,489
are a little different in a way that you

856
00:38:48,380 --> 00:38:44,680
know the mass sightings the radar

857
00:38:54,089 --> 00:38:48,390
returns all that whatever it is that

858
00:38:58,759 --> 00:38:54,099
there seem to be so much closer to grasp

859
00:39:02,130 --> 00:38:58,769
than some of the other things that we

860
00:39:03,809 --> 00:39:02,140
encounter like ghosts and [\h__\h] sure

861
00:39:05,940 --> 00:39:03,819
and one of the biggest things is I mean

862
00:39:09,359 --> 00:39:05,950
you can you can look at tons of evidence

863
00:39:11,579 --> 00:39:09,369
on UFOs I mean we still get on the

864
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:11,589
average about seven or eight reports of

865
00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:14,970
glowing orange orbs in in our state

866
00:39:20,839 --> 00:39:18,249
we've got a very good picture one which

867
00:39:29,579 --> 00:39:20,849
was taken by a student at a university

868
00:39:31,349 --> 00:39:29,589
we have it's uh just triangles triangles

869
00:39:33,390 --> 00:39:31,359
and orbs right now in the last I would

870
00:39:39,180 --> 00:39:33,400
say three years are the most that we're

871
00:39:40,799 --> 00:39:39,190
getting reports on last one being one of

872
00:39:43,499 --> 00:39:40,809
my guys who's actually a police officer

873
00:39:45,349 --> 00:39:43,509
was coming home from work and he spotted

874
00:39:47,549 --> 00:39:45,359
one crossing the highway above him and

875
00:39:50,099 --> 00:39:47,559
you know turned around and tried to

876
00:39:53,969 --> 00:39:50,109
follow this but long as he could it was

877
00:39:58,579 --> 00:39:53,979
very very slow or or I know this was a

878
00:40:06,150 --> 00:39:58,589
triangle uh-huh yeah and uh very large

879
00:40:07,799 --> 00:40:06,160
and it just uh he said it was so so

880
00:40:09,959 --> 00:40:07,809
large it had to make a noise but it made

881
00:40:11,370 --> 00:40:09,969
no noise whatsoever because he stopped

882
00:40:12,809 --> 00:40:11,380
the car and got out right along the

883
00:40:14,670 --> 00:40:12,819
highway and he said I didn't hear a

884
00:40:19,819 --> 00:40:14,680
thing and he said it passed right over

885
00:40:24,779 --> 00:40:19,829
top of me and it had two very small

886
00:40:26,549 --> 00:40:24,789
lights in the middle which really

887
00:40:28,380 --> 00:40:26,559
weren't any particular colors that it

888
00:40:32,269 --> 00:40:28,390
was just was like looking at an old lava

889
00:40:34,979 --> 00:40:32,279
lamp if you remember those oh yeah and

890
00:40:36,730 --> 00:40:34,989
then not too long after that sighting we

891
00:40:39,190 --> 00:40:36,740
had another one in

892
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:39,200
in exeter pennsylvania which is right

893
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:41,810
down the road from the other side of a

894
00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:45,410
similar object again a triangle but it

895
00:40:51,940 --> 00:40:47,450
was followed by three orbs above it and

896
00:40:53,859 --> 00:40:51,950
the orbs were red in color and they got

897
00:40:56,770 --> 00:40:53,869
some pictures but they used a camera

898
00:40:58,720 --> 00:40:56,780
phone camera and it didn't really really

899
00:41:01,359 --> 00:40:58,730
outline the triangle you can see the you

900
00:41:06,099 --> 00:41:01,369
could see the orbs but not make the out

901
00:41:09,820 --> 00:41:06,109
the the triangle too well yeah

902
00:41:11,590 --> 00:41:09,830
now there's but there was some up on the

903
00:41:13,750 --> 00:41:11,600
chat room the people saying that the one

904
00:41:16,090 --> 00:41:13,760
guy says I missed the saucers I love

905
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:16,100
that well you know what there there

906
00:41:22,210 --> 00:41:18,410
hasn't been I haven't seen or read of

907
00:41:24,340 --> 00:41:22,220
any reports of saucers in years I mean

908
00:41:32,130 --> 00:41:24,350
they're either coming through as cigar

909
00:41:34,450 --> 00:41:32,140
shape triangle squares yeah orbs um

910
00:41:40,270 --> 00:41:34,460
another one that started popping up

911
00:41:44,830 --> 00:41:40,280
about two years ago was a long flat

912
00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:44,840
rectangle so I don't you know the

913
00:41:49,420 --> 00:41:47,450
classic saucer I haven't seen one of

914
00:41:51,010 --> 00:41:49,430
those reports in years I've seen some

915
00:41:53,230 --> 00:41:51,020
photographs that were taken or

916
00:41:54,970 --> 00:41:53,240
supposedly taken recently but when you

917
00:41:56,290 --> 00:41:54,980
look at the photographs you can you know

918
00:41:59,680 --> 00:41:56,300
and I'll take two five minutes to figure

919
00:42:01,810 --> 00:41:59,690
out that they were photoshopped well you

920
00:42:06,609 --> 00:42:01,820
know that was the sighting I had in 2006

921
00:42:07,900 --> 00:42:06,619
was definitely a disc and you know

922
00:42:09,580 --> 00:42:07,910
you're right I've talked about that a

923
00:42:11,290 --> 00:42:09,590
number of times that it seems like you

924
00:42:15,099 --> 00:42:11,300
know maybe that's the old model and the

925
00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:15,109
new model is the triangle this year's

926
00:42:21,460 --> 00:42:18,650
model but no it's really strange I think

927
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:21,470
it's strange that it would change or

928
00:42:26,590 --> 00:42:23,450
that would be seeing something different

929
00:42:30,210 --> 00:42:26,600
and that could be something simple like

930
00:42:33,849 --> 00:42:30,220
if we are being visited from another

931
00:42:35,470 --> 00:42:33,859
species out there let's just say I never

932
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:35,480
like to say we are definitely it's

933
00:42:40,390 --> 00:42:37,850
definitely extraterrestrial I would say

934
00:42:42,340 --> 00:42:40,400
it's most likely or it could be but all

935
00:42:44,680 --> 00:42:42,350
you know when you investigate this stuff

936
00:42:45,550 --> 00:42:44,690
after a while you better have a really

937
00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:45,560
open mind

938
00:42:51,790 --> 00:42:50,210
because I know I've read things I was

939
00:42:53,380 --> 00:42:51,800
seen things I've been involved in things

940
00:42:55,660 --> 00:42:53,390
that from life of me with all the

941
00:42:58,900 --> 00:42:55,670
technology we have I can't figure out

942
00:43:00,940 --> 00:42:58,910
nobody else can either and I've got 64

943
00:43:02,470 --> 00:43:00,950
people that I can show this to or or

944
00:43:04,780 --> 00:43:02,480
talk to about something and if they

945
00:43:07,150 --> 00:43:04,790
can't come up with anything and I can't

946
00:43:09,460 --> 00:43:07,160
come up with anything you know it's just

947
00:43:10,870 --> 00:43:09,470
another thing it's unexplainable but

948
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:10,880
when you see something travel across the

949
00:43:14,920 --> 00:43:13,130
sky from Horizon to Horizon zigzagging

950
00:43:17,859 --> 00:43:14,930
all the way in a matter of an eye blink

951
00:43:21,010 --> 00:43:17,869
or two that's not ours we don't have

952
00:43:22,750 --> 00:43:21,020
anything that fast or you're standing

953
00:43:24,310 --> 00:43:22,760
there talking with a state trooper and

954
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:24,320
he said oh what's that you see something

955
00:43:29,200 --> 00:43:27,530
zigzagging and it stops drops makes a U

956
00:43:31,300 --> 00:43:29,210
and comes back up and then continues on

957
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:31,310
it way and he doesn't think any of the

958
00:43:34,720 --> 00:43:32,810
other because he sees them all the time

959
00:43:38,339 --> 00:43:34,730
that's the first I've ever seen one of

960
00:43:40,359 --> 00:43:38,349
my life like that so you know it's

961
00:43:42,810 --> 00:43:40,369
whatever's out there whether it be

962
00:43:45,970 --> 00:43:42,820
ufology the paranormal of cryptozoology

963
00:43:48,720 --> 00:43:45,980
we have answers for some things and we

964
00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:48,730
have others that we have no answers for

965
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:53,690
yeah yeah I know and you know that

966
00:43:58,690 --> 00:43:55,970
that's one of the main reasons I'd like

967
00:44:01,960 --> 00:43:58,700
to do this show is just to I'm not

968
00:44:05,470 --> 00:44:01,970
thinking that it's most likely that I

969
00:44:09,430 --> 00:44:05,480
will ever know what the heck is going on

970
00:44:12,460 --> 00:44:09,440
but it's always the interesting part is

971
00:44:15,370 --> 00:44:12,470
to explore here people's sightings and

972
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:15,380
also people's ideas on what they may be

973
00:44:19,390 --> 00:44:18,050
seeing or what they possibly could be

974
00:44:22,180 --> 00:44:19,400
that that's one of the things that

975
00:44:24,310 --> 00:44:22,190
really keeps me in it yeah and and I

976
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:24,320
like I like call myself a skeptical

977
00:44:28,570 --> 00:44:27,050
believer because you know without the

978
00:44:29,290 --> 00:44:28,580
evidence of proof you're just telling me

979
00:44:32,500 --> 00:44:29,300
another story

980
00:44:40,089 --> 00:44:32,510
mm-hm and I've heard and read thousands

981
00:44:43,030 --> 00:44:40,099
of those so um you know I try to stay on

982
00:44:44,620 --> 00:44:43,040
a level path with this you know it could

983
00:44:46,780 --> 00:44:44,630
be this it could be that or it could not

984
00:44:48,579 --> 00:44:46,790
be this or it could not be that and then

985
00:44:51,940 --> 00:44:48,589
you know make up my own mind write my

986
00:44:52,780 --> 00:44:51,950
report and that's it now why while we're

987
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:52,790
on this subject

988
00:44:58,359 --> 00:44:55,450
along these lines why do you think

989
00:45:01,000 --> 00:44:58,369
someone in the science field doesn't

990
00:45:03,310 --> 00:45:01,010
want to try to really look at this hard

991
00:45:05,609 --> 00:45:03,320
now there are some people but it's few

992
00:45:09,759 --> 00:45:05,619
and far between

993
00:45:11,949 --> 00:45:09,769
well it's the same most likely the same

994
00:45:14,049 --> 00:45:11,959
reason that the government is never

995
00:45:16,089 --> 00:45:14,059
going to disclose anything I mean I know

996
00:45:17,380 --> 00:45:16,099
there's a lot of people that say oh well

997
00:45:19,809 --> 00:45:17,390
disclosure is going to happen next week

998
00:45:22,059 --> 00:45:19,819
next month next year you're never going

999
00:45:24,160 --> 00:45:22,069
to have any disclosure because for them

1000
00:45:26,019 --> 00:45:24,170
to disclose they'd have to admit the

1001
00:45:27,910 --> 00:45:26,029
line for the last 50 or so years yeah

1002
00:45:29,499 --> 00:45:27,920
and the same thing happens what

1003
00:45:32,739 --> 00:45:29,509
scientists have been pooh-poohing it now

1004
00:45:34,870 --> 00:45:32,749
for whatever time if it does came that

1005
00:45:39,549 --> 00:45:34,880
those guys their credibility would be

1006
00:45:41,319 --> 00:45:39,559
shot in a millisecond so it's easier to

1007
00:45:45,029 --> 00:45:41,329
stand there and be a skeptic than it is

1008
00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:45,039
to be a approver of truth and evidence

1009
00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:48,410
and even do even then when you do come

1010
00:45:53,079 --> 00:45:51,410
out with proven evidence somebody'll

1011
00:45:55,479 --> 00:45:53,089
come at me and say you manufactured it

1012
00:45:59,469 --> 00:45:55,489
you know it's just a big hassle yeah so

1013
00:46:00,609 --> 00:45:59,479
I I think you know I often laugh people

1014
00:46:02,259 --> 00:46:00,619
say well when do you think they'll be

1015
00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:02,269
disclosure I said when somebody one of

1016
00:46:06,309 --> 00:46:04,130
those things lands in some farmers yard

1017
00:46:09,729 --> 00:46:06,319
and he's smart enough to call the news

1018
00:46:13,809 --> 00:46:09,739
before he calls the police hmm well you

1019
00:46:17,920 --> 00:46:13,819
know I I had a conversation a while ago

1020
00:46:22,660 --> 00:46:17,930
with dr. Melba Ketchum um you know the

1021
00:46:25,509 --> 00:46:22,670
Bigfoot DNA research and you know she

1022
00:46:28,689 --> 00:46:25,519
like just a very nice lady by the way

1023
00:46:31,449 --> 00:46:28,699
and and she just you know threw caution

1024
00:46:36,339 --> 00:46:31,459
to the wind and all her background in

1025
00:46:38,979 --> 00:46:36,349
many years of her work that she she has

1026
00:46:42,189 --> 00:46:38,989
done she can now no longer testify in

1027
00:46:44,439 --> 00:46:42,199
court you know many things because she

1028
00:46:46,420 --> 00:46:44,449
just took this subject seriously and

1029
00:46:49,650 --> 00:46:46,430
that's what can that's what can happen

1030
00:46:51,789 --> 00:46:49,660
and she's had death threats she's had a

1031
00:46:54,699 --> 00:46:51,799
place where she was going to speak

1032
00:46:56,259 --> 00:46:54,709
someone actually bombed it just you know

1033
00:47:01,150 --> 00:46:56,269
prior to when she was going to be there

1034
00:47:04,089 --> 00:47:01,160
mm-hm so it's amazing work

1035
00:47:09,009 --> 00:47:04,099
you know people can just people don't

1036
00:47:12,039 --> 00:47:09,019
want to have anything something big like

1037
00:47:14,019 --> 00:47:12,049
this looked at seriously it seems well

1038
00:47:17,770 --> 00:47:14,029
not while they don't because I mean

1039
00:47:19,150 --> 00:47:17,780
first of all look at how many folks up

1040
00:47:21,430 --> 00:47:19,160
let me put it to you this way I have 12

1041
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:21,440
books here on my shelf I'm looking at in

1042
00:47:25,660 --> 00:47:23,690
the monks 1,500 of them but there's 12

1043
00:47:27,310 --> 00:47:25,670
on the shelf I keep separately they're

1044
00:47:29,710 --> 00:47:27,320
all written by different authors they're

1045
00:47:33,490 --> 00:47:29,720
all on Roswell crash every one of them

1046
00:47:35,500 --> 00:47:33,500
which one am I supposed to believe avail

1047
00:47:37,420 --> 00:47:35,510
pardon me it they all different

1048
00:47:39,070 --> 00:47:37,430
accountings all different every one is

1049
00:47:44,230 --> 00:47:39,080
different by a different author so which

1050
00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:44,240
one do I believe good point yeah and and

1051
00:47:51,520 --> 00:47:49,610
you have you have this guy says this

1052
00:47:53,110 --> 00:47:51,530
then this guy says well that guy's nuts

1053
00:47:55,390 --> 00:47:53,120
this is what really happened then that

1054
00:47:56,470 --> 00:47:55,400
guy says this guy's crazy because that's

1055
00:47:58,480 --> 00:47:56,480
not what happened the first guy was

1056
00:48:00,730 --> 00:47:58,490
right or sort of right but my idea is

1057
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:00,740
better and then they wonder why people

1058
00:48:05,530 --> 00:48:02,330
are confused when they talk about UFOs

1059
00:48:07,300 --> 00:48:05,540
so they talk to people about UFOs I mean

1060
00:48:10,750 --> 00:48:07,310
they've been fed garbage for so long

1061
00:48:14,230 --> 00:48:10,760
that you know I would say out of all

1062
00:48:16,270 --> 00:48:14,240
these books there might be a dozen or

1063
00:48:18,700 --> 00:48:16,280
two that I may say would be close to

1064
00:48:20,380 --> 00:48:18,710
factual and then when you find out that

1065
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:20,390
the people who wrote these books never

1066
00:48:25,660 --> 00:48:22,970
saw a UFO or never went out in the field

1067
00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:25,670
and investigated the UFO that's a little

1068
00:48:34,810 --> 00:48:32,570
disheartening to me yeah I understand

1069
00:48:37,210 --> 00:48:34,820
what you're saying um but I I think

1070
00:48:40,030 --> 00:48:37,220
there are some good people out there

1071
00:48:42,460 --> 00:48:40,040
that are trying to do nothing absolutely

1072
00:48:45,670 --> 00:48:42,470
have you blogging an excellent job MUFON

1073
00:48:48,010 --> 00:48:45,680
has a crapload of good investigators but

1074
00:48:49,930 --> 00:48:48,020
they're kind of hampered because when

1075
00:48:51,520 --> 00:48:49,940
they do an investigation that

1076
00:48:55,240 --> 00:48:51,530
investigation ends when they turn it

1077
00:48:57,340 --> 00:48:55,250
into a CMS file ah well at the end of it

1078
00:48:59,530 --> 00:48:57,350
let's talk a little bit about that you

1079
00:49:02,290 --> 00:48:59,540
know I don't want to MUFON bash but

1080
00:49:04,750 --> 00:49:02,300
there oh no absolutely not but I do get

1081
00:49:07,630 --> 00:49:04,760
I actually do get a lot of contacts from

1082
00:49:09,900 --> 00:49:07,640
people that are that do feel that way

1083
00:49:13,570 --> 00:49:09,910
and feel like a lot of things are not

1084
00:49:18,010 --> 00:49:13,580
available to you know do more work on

1085
00:49:19,390 --> 00:49:18,020
and that's one of the things but people

1086
00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:19,400
have to understand that you know you're

1087
00:49:24,430 --> 00:49:21,050
talking about an organization it's got a

1088
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:24,440
lot of folks and if they had to equip

1089
00:49:30,799 --> 00:49:26,690
those people and get them all out in the

1090
00:49:34,029 --> 00:49:30,809
field that would be tons of money

1091
00:49:36,529 --> 00:49:34,039
and the independent researchers you know

1092
00:49:38,449 --> 00:49:36,539
like JC Johnson that investigates

1093
00:49:41,029 --> 00:49:38,459
paranormal things on the four corners of

1094
00:49:44,719 --> 00:49:41,039
this country I mean he self-funded and

1095
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:44,729
he travels all over four states but if

1096
00:49:48,709 --> 00:49:46,890
he was with MUFON or any other large

1097
00:49:50,709 --> 00:49:48,719
group he couldn't do that because

1098
00:49:52,759 --> 00:49:50,719
they're not going to fund him to do that

1099
00:49:55,009 --> 00:49:52,769
you know they wouldn't they're not going

1100
00:50:00,140 --> 00:49:55,019
to fund my $90,000 truck with equipment

1101
00:50:02,209 --> 00:50:00,150
out there no way so although there are

1102
00:50:04,099 --> 00:50:02,219
and we have MUFON members in my group

1103
00:50:05,569 --> 00:50:04,109
and they're very good and they've been

1104
00:50:09,529 --> 00:50:05,579
there a long time and they know what

1105
00:50:12,979 --> 00:50:09,539
they're doing and uh but I have more I

1106
00:50:15,079 --> 00:50:12,989
give them more access and the benefit of

1107
00:50:18,169 --> 00:50:15,089
having the equipment they need on the

1108
00:50:21,439 --> 00:50:18,179
spur of the moment which I don't think

1109
00:50:22,939 --> 00:50:21,449
MUFON can do till this day they couldn't

1110
00:50:25,549 --> 00:50:22,949
when I was involved as a start team

1111
00:50:26,719 --> 00:50:25,559
member and a chief investigator they

1112
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:26,729
couldn't do it then and I don't think

1113
00:50:31,459 --> 00:50:29,130
they could do it now so when you were

1114
00:50:34,969 --> 00:50:31,469
when you were an investigator did you

1115
00:50:38,269 --> 00:50:34,979
ever hear any rumblings of you know the

1116
00:50:39,739 --> 00:50:38,279
possible CIA connection with MUFON well

1117
00:50:41,329 --> 00:50:39,749
yeah I think that probably started at

1118
00:50:44,269 --> 00:50:41,339
day number two after they started to

1119
00:50:46,999 --> 00:50:44,279
started move on look everybody's going

1120
00:50:50,449 --> 00:50:47,009
to look for something to discredit

1121
00:50:52,459 --> 00:50:50,459
somebody it doesn't matter they'll say

1122
00:50:59,359 --> 00:50:52,469
you know MUFON is owned by Bob Bigelow

1123
00:51:01,839 --> 00:50:59,369
or MUFON is a government agency in the

1124
00:51:05,029 --> 00:51:01,849
clandestine operation

1125
00:51:07,449 --> 00:51:05,039
MUFON throws away their reports that's

1126
00:51:09,829 --> 00:51:07,459
all silly that's that's not factual

1127
00:51:11,569 --> 00:51:09,839
MUFON is just a big organization that

1128
00:51:13,069 --> 00:51:11,579
collects a lot of data and has a lot of

1129
00:51:16,819 --> 00:51:13,079
investigators out there collecting data

1130
00:51:20,390 --> 00:51:16,829
so as far as that goes

1131
00:51:23,149 --> 00:51:20,400
uh I give them kudos because I mean I

1132
00:51:24,529 --> 00:51:23,159
did it with them I did for them and it

1133
00:51:26,630 --> 00:51:24,539
takes a lot of work and it's

1134
00:51:30,099 --> 00:51:26,640
out-of-pocket expenses not as much as

1135
00:51:32,479 --> 00:51:30,109
doing it on your own but uh it's uh

1136
00:51:34,370 --> 00:51:32,489
they'll be around for a long time I mean

1137
00:51:36,199 --> 00:51:34,380
I know people saying that I've heard and

1138
00:51:41,599 --> 00:51:36,209
I've read on the internet that you know

1139
00:51:44,630 --> 00:51:41,609
they're going to uh you know just

1140
00:51:45,829 --> 00:51:44,640
getting done you know

1141
00:51:47,059 --> 00:51:45,839
they're just going to fold they're going

1142
00:51:48,710 --> 00:51:47,069
to do this it's going to happen next

1143
00:51:50,329 --> 00:51:48,720
month and next month and next one

1144
00:51:51,859 --> 00:51:50,339
that's silly it's just nonsense

1145
00:51:55,910 --> 00:51:51,869
smooth-on will be around a long time

1146
00:51:57,799 --> 00:51:55,920
it's a good operation how they how they

1147
00:51:59,299 --> 00:51:57,809
control all those people is beyond me I

1148
00:52:02,329 --> 00:51:59,309
don't know what they have 3500 members

1149
00:52:04,630 --> 00:52:02,339
or something like that it's uh it's busy

1150
00:52:07,670 --> 00:52:04,640
it's about that's just busy

1151
00:52:11,269 --> 00:52:07,680
yeah now there was we actually had a

1152
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:11,279
guest on the show and he you know he's

1153
00:52:17,569 --> 00:52:13,890
probably does listen to the show who

1154
00:52:19,970 --> 00:52:17,579
actually had first-hand a firsthand

1155
00:52:23,509 --> 00:52:19,980
incident that happened right in front of

1156
00:52:26,559 --> 00:52:23,519
them was a actual tie at one point this

1157
00:52:29,180 --> 00:52:26,569
is going back into the 1980s were a

1158
00:52:31,250 --> 00:52:29,190
convention if you if if you are

1159
00:52:34,130 --> 00:52:31,260
listening and you are welcome to call in

1160
00:52:38,450 --> 00:52:34,140
and share your story once more he was on

1161
00:52:40,789 --> 00:52:38,460
a while back 6:03 967 403 OS the number

1162
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:40,799
if anyone wants to call in and ask our

1163
00:52:48,289 --> 00:52:44,130
guest a question so I don't know you

1164
00:52:51,499 --> 00:52:48,299
know I mean I I you know the thing you

1165
00:52:53,180 --> 00:52:51,509
do here is that they were infiltrated or

1166
00:52:55,640 --> 00:52:53,190
whatever because they wanted to know

1167
00:52:57,200 --> 00:52:55,650
what information that was being gathered

1168
00:52:59,809 --> 00:52:57,210
out there whether that's true or whether

1169
00:53:01,309 --> 00:52:59,819
they'd even bother I have no idea why

1170
00:53:03,529 --> 00:53:01,319
would they bother I mean they got the

1171
00:53:05,690 --> 00:53:03,539
CIA the DoD they got spooks all over the

1172
00:53:07,819 --> 00:53:05,700
place they want to find out something

1173
00:53:09,470 --> 00:53:07,829
about you me or anybody else or any any

1174
00:53:10,759 --> 00:53:09,480
group that's out there they could do

1175
00:53:13,370 --> 00:53:10,769
that without them ever knowing about it

1176
00:53:15,170 --> 00:53:13,380
they wouldn't have to buy the business

1177
00:53:18,170 --> 00:53:15,180
or you know infiltrate the business they

1178
00:53:19,579 --> 00:53:18,180
could just do it and your story right

1179
00:53:21,380 --> 00:53:19,589
you know they can watch all their email

1180
00:53:22,609 --> 00:53:21,390
like I watch every conversation you list

1181
00:53:24,859 --> 00:53:22,619
everything they're saying and they

1182
00:53:26,660 --> 00:53:24,869
wouldn't know the difference so I think

1183
00:53:29,329 --> 00:53:26,670
that's just you know the conspiracy

1184
00:53:30,859 --> 00:53:29,339
theorist kind of make me crazy because I

1185
00:53:33,859 --> 00:53:30,869
just say might I was just going to ask

1186
00:53:35,720 --> 00:53:33,869
you if I sounded like a conspiracy well

1187
00:53:37,039 --> 00:53:35,730
you know it could make a conspirator you

1188
00:53:39,980 --> 00:53:37,049
know give me your birthdate now make a

1189
00:53:41,359 --> 00:53:39,990
conspiracy out of it you know hey you

1190
00:53:44,720 --> 00:53:41,369
can make a conspiracy out of anything

1191
00:53:47,120 --> 00:53:44,730
but the when you want to get to the real

1192
00:53:49,370 --> 00:53:47,130
bottom line you got a deal with fact

1193
00:53:51,740 --> 00:53:49,380
fact in evidence that's what you need

1194
00:53:53,749 --> 00:53:51,750
you need to have the evidence you need

1195
00:53:57,319 --> 00:53:53,759
to have the facts can could it happen

1196
00:53:58,610 --> 00:53:57,329
did it not happen I go to the scene talk

1197
00:54:03,170 --> 00:53:58,620
to the people face-to-face

1198
00:54:05,990 --> 00:54:03,180
I don't do any interviews with anybody

1199
00:54:09,860 --> 00:54:06,000
unless they're out of state or they're

1200
00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:09,870
too far away to go over the internet or

1201
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:12,210
by phone I try to do everything face to

1202
00:54:18,530 --> 00:54:15,930
face uh because I can see what they're

1203
00:54:20,480 --> 00:54:18,540
talking about I can see what facts are

1204
00:54:22,670 --> 00:54:20,490
going to present I'm looking at them

1205
00:54:24,890 --> 00:54:22,680
right in the eye you know and they're

1206
00:54:26,930 --> 00:54:24,900
showing me what they saw where they saw

1207
00:54:29,140 --> 00:54:26,940
it and I can you know do a lot of things

1208
00:54:31,400 --> 00:54:29,150
to find out if that could happen or not

1209
00:54:33,620 --> 00:54:31,410
that circle in their yard that's been

1210
00:54:37,460 --> 00:54:33,630
growing now over the damp season for the

1211
00:54:40,370 --> 00:54:37,470
last two years is mold you know Ivan are

1212
00:54:43,070 --> 00:54:40,380
you sample of it to show them so it's

1213
00:54:48,710 --> 00:54:43,080
not a crop circle or it's not a landing

1214
00:54:53,330 --> 00:54:48,720
side of the UFO and um uh you know we've

1215
00:55:00,110 --> 00:54:53,340
investigated a well a little over 2,500

1216
00:55:01,490 --> 00:55:00,120
cases now since 2009 yeah I want to talk

1217
00:55:03,350 --> 00:55:01,500
to you a little bit about some of the

1218
00:55:06,080 --> 00:55:03,360
cases you've investigated but before

1219
00:55:07,670 --> 00:55:06,090
that before you make the trip out to

1220
00:55:11,720 --> 00:55:07,680
actually speak to someone

1221
00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:11,730
what type of preliminary information do

1222
00:55:16,760 --> 00:55:13,770
you need before you actually pack up

1223
00:55:18,170 --> 00:55:16,770
your truck and go there okay what what

1224
00:55:22,820 --> 00:55:18,180
we'll do is we'll of course take the

1225
00:55:24,470 --> 00:55:22,830
original location and then we'll do a

1226
00:55:25,550 --> 00:55:24,480
background on the location see if there

1227
00:55:30,850 --> 00:55:25,560
are any other sightings in that area

1228
00:55:33,530 --> 00:55:30,860
that County that Street or whatever and

1229
00:55:35,870 --> 00:55:33,540
see as try to get as much as we can

1230
00:55:38,270 --> 00:55:35,880
historically doing some background

1231
00:55:41,230 --> 00:55:38,280
research from years back I'll go back

1232
00:55:44,690 --> 00:55:41,240
sometimes in uh five to ten years and

1233
00:55:46,430 --> 00:55:44,700
and you know if there's the same lights

1234
00:55:49,010 --> 00:55:46,440
being seen in the same time in the same

1235
00:55:50,570 --> 00:55:49,020
place over a period of five or ten years

1236
00:55:54,020 --> 00:55:50,580
well then I'm probably dealing with

1237
00:55:55,520 --> 00:55:54,030
something that's man-made uh you know

1238
00:55:58,880 --> 00:55:55,530
especially when somebody gives you

1239
00:56:01,850 --> 00:55:58,890
explicit directions like uh I see in the

1240
00:56:03,290 --> 00:56:01,860
northwest sky every every once a month

1241
00:56:10,040 --> 00:56:03,300
or something like that usually turns out

1242
00:56:12,420 --> 00:56:10,050
to be either a satellite or a planet and

1243
00:56:19,560 --> 00:56:12,430
uh then you have

1244
00:56:21,870 --> 00:56:19,570
a weather is very important and then

1245
00:56:23,820 --> 00:56:21,880
when you get on the scene you know and

1246
00:56:25,620 --> 00:56:23,830
you hear the story now the dis story

1247
00:56:27,360 --> 00:56:25,630
change from the time I got the reports

1248
00:56:29,910 --> 00:56:27,370
of the time now that I'm on the scene

1249
00:56:32,940 --> 00:56:29,920
that's another kicker that gets me you

1250
00:56:35,220 --> 00:56:32,950
know the story changes or we get a meet

1251
00:56:37,140 --> 00:56:35,230
to ISM and a meet - ISM is the neighbor

1252
00:56:38,760 --> 00:56:37,150
coming over when he sees the truck

1253
00:56:43,740 --> 00:56:38,770
parked out front says yeah I saw it me

1254
00:56:45,300 --> 00:56:43,750
too I thought so but background research

1255
00:56:47,430 --> 00:56:45,310
is very important before you even get to

1256
00:56:49,290 --> 00:56:47,440
the get to the scene I mean you have to

1257
00:56:51,720 --> 00:56:49,300
know what your what the background is of

1258
00:56:53,430 --> 00:56:51,730
the area is there as there an Air Force

1259
00:56:55,470 --> 00:56:53,440
Base or is there a testing area for

1260
00:56:57,120 --> 00:56:55,480
missiles nearby or is there anything but

1261
00:56:59,310 --> 00:56:57,130
nearby that could you know that could

1262
00:57:01,350 --> 00:56:59,320
cause what they saw and then you just

1263
00:57:03,420 --> 00:57:01,360
take it from there and then just follow

1264
00:57:05,070 --> 00:57:03,430
up on it and just keep going until you

1265
00:57:06,510 --> 00:57:05,080
come to your conclusion yeah with

1266
00:57:08,550 --> 00:57:06,520
everything you have invested in your

1267
00:57:09,800 --> 00:57:08,560
time it's you want to make sure no one's

1268
00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:09,810
going to waste it that's for sure

1269
00:57:15,420 --> 00:57:13,330
yeah well and and I don't I've had it

1270
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:15,430
wasted but sometimes the waste is good

1271
00:57:19,350 --> 00:57:17,050
because something will always come up

1272
00:57:20,820 --> 00:57:19,360
where they'll say well you know the guys

1273
00:57:22,650 --> 00:57:20,830
owns the bar down the street you know he

1274
00:57:24,930 --> 00:57:22,660
saw something one time about any good

1275
00:57:27,030 --> 00:57:24,940
down the bar you talk to that guy you

1276
00:57:28,890 --> 00:57:27,040
know and he may put you in a better

1277
00:57:31,100 --> 00:57:28,900
direction or maybe he'll back up what

1278
00:57:34,530 --> 00:57:31,110
the other guy said or vice-versa

1279
00:57:36,870 --> 00:57:34,540
yeah right now someone just in the

1280
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:36,880
message room wanted to know what are

1281
00:57:41,370 --> 00:57:38,850
some of the cases you've investigated

1282
00:57:43,950 --> 00:57:41,380
well we have some active ones right now

1283
00:57:45,750 --> 00:57:43,960
that I've been going on for years I see

1284
00:57:50,370 --> 00:57:45,760
a lot of on your chat room but Todd sees

1285
00:57:56,100 --> 00:57:50,380
that's still an ongoing case Todd sees

1286
00:57:59,190 --> 00:57:56,110
case started in 2008 and we've been on

1287
00:58:04,170 --> 00:57:59,200
it ever since we have a cold-case unit

1288
00:58:05,760 --> 00:58:04,180
that works the case and it's a it's

1289
00:58:08,070 --> 00:58:05,770
probably the strangest case I've ever

1290
00:58:10,490 --> 00:58:08,080
investigated on anything I am not

1291
00:58:14,430 --> 00:58:10,500
familiar with it and i'ma give you

1292
00:58:16,620 --> 00:58:14,440
obviously yeah okay Todd cease was a

1293
00:58:18,680 --> 00:58:16,630
gentleman of thirty four years old but

1294
00:58:21,900 --> 00:58:18,690
one morning

1295
00:58:24,540 --> 00:58:21,910
as he did many times during pre deer

1296
00:58:25,870 --> 00:58:24,550
season would get on his ATV and go up

1297
00:58:27,840 --> 00:58:25,880
into the woods very heavily would

1298
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:27,850
area in Northumberland Pennsylvania and

1299
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:30,410
look for deer spot gear for the coming

1300
00:58:38,140 --> 00:58:34,010
season he was an avid Archer and uh he

1301
00:58:42,850 --> 00:58:38,150
was last seen that day at 1:00 a.m. and

1302
00:58:43,300 --> 00:58:42,860
uh got on his ATV and took off into the

1303
00:58:45,520 --> 00:58:43,310
woods

1304
00:58:49,810 --> 00:58:45,530
and told his wife he'd be back like it

1305
00:58:52,900 --> 00:58:49,820
uh he has let me just correct me 39 yeah

1306
00:58:56,160 --> 00:58:52,910
okay uh trying to remember everything

1307
00:58:59,650 --> 00:58:56,170
about this case from the beginning he

1308
00:59:02,080 --> 00:58:59,660
went into the woody wooded area and did

1309
00:59:03,910 --> 00:59:02,090
return and at two o'clock the family got

1310
00:59:06,220 --> 00:59:03,920
nervous and wife called the police

1311
00:59:07,840 --> 00:59:06,230
reported missing family members showed

1312
00:59:10,810 --> 00:59:07,850
up brothers father and they all went

1313
00:59:11,980 --> 00:59:10,820
looking for him son trying to find him

1314
00:59:15,940 --> 00:59:11,990
they couldn't find him they did locate

1315
00:59:18,870 --> 00:59:15,950
the ATV they saw the ATV which was

1316
00:59:21,250 --> 00:59:18,880
approximately one mile from the home

1317
00:59:22,540 --> 00:59:21,260
they brought they could bring it back

1318
00:59:23,950 --> 00:59:22,550
because I couldn't find the keys and

1319
00:59:26,770 --> 00:59:23,960
they wound up telling it back later but

1320
00:59:29,020 --> 00:59:26,780
the search went on about two hundred and

1321
00:59:30,610 --> 00:59:29,030
thirty five searchers we found out with

1322
00:59:32,830 --> 00:59:30,620
the actual searchers that showed up

1323
00:59:34,900 --> 00:59:32,840
which would have been local police too

1324
00:59:36,880 --> 00:59:34,910
far three fire companies to search dog

1325
00:59:39,370 --> 00:59:36,890
teams um

1326
00:59:41,940 --> 00:59:39,380
one cadaver dog and one one set of

1327
00:59:44,890 --> 00:59:41,950
cadaver dogs on one set of bloodhounds

1328
00:59:46,840 --> 00:59:44,900
there was a state police helicopter in

1329
00:59:50,970 --> 00:59:46,850
the sky there were state troopers on the

1330
00:59:53,830 --> 00:59:50,980
scene also many people that knew him a

1331
00:59:56,950 --> 00:59:53,840
lot of folks relatives everybody out

1332
01:00:04,450 --> 00:59:56,960
looking for him and nobody finds this

1333
01:00:07,390 --> 01:00:04,460
guy and a lot of this stuff we have not

1334
01:00:10,660 --> 01:00:07,400
posted very much on this case on the

1335
01:00:13,630 --> 01:00:10,670
internet because it's still ongoing but

1336
01:00:15,760 --> 01:00:13,640
everything that we have gotten on the

1337
01:00:18,610 --> 01:00:15,770
case we don't rely on the original

1338
01:00:20,710 --> 01:00:18,620
reporting of the case which was all

1339
01:00:22,300 --> 01:00:20,720
taken from a newspaper which was

1340
01:00:24,040 --> 01:00:22,310
doctored many times and has now been

1341
01:00:26,770 --> 01:00:24,050
taken off the newspaper archives since

1342
01:00:28,540 --> 01:00:26,780
we've been investigating everything

1343
01:00:31,120 --> 01:00:28,550
we've gotten so far in the last six

1344
01:00:33,130 --> 01:00:31,130
years is in black and white we've had

1345
01:00:35,290 --> 01:00:33,140
everything done where we didn't ask

1346
01:00:37,810 --> 01:00:35,300
anybody for a phone answer we got

1347
01:00:39,640 --> 01:00:37,820
everything on there letterheads

1348
01:00:42,670 --> 01:00:39,650
we have the autopsy

1349
01:00:44,710 --> 01:00:42,680
or we have a toxicology report and what

1350
01:00:47,770 --> 01:00:44,720
happened was that they didn't find him

1351
01:00:53,130 --> 01:00:47,780
the first day the second day they didn't

1352
01:00:56,080 --> 01:00:53,140
find him till it was about 7:00

1353
01:00:59,080 --> 01:00:56,090
something the evening 754 I believe it

1354
01:01:04,590 --> 01:00:59,090
was that the body was located he was

1355
01:01:07,560 --> 01:01:04,600
identified and removed from the scene

1356
01:01:12,790 --> 01:01:07,570
autopsy followed he was found to have

1357
01:01:16,890 --> 01:01:12,800
died of a cocaine technology overdose of

1358
01:01:19,600 --> 01:01:16,900
cocaine now kind of simple thing right

1359
01:01:21,850 --> 01:01:19,610
but it turns out that he had no drug

1360
01:01:24,580 --> 01:01:21,860
abuse background we could find no arrest

1361
01:01:26,200 --> 01:01:24,590
records on a traffic ticket all his

1362
01:01:29,260 --> 01:01:26,210
personal information like on the social

1363
01:01:31,360 --> 01:01:29,270
security death site and military records

1364
01:01:33,310 --> 01:01:31,370
driver's license hunting license none of

1365
01:01:37,870 --> 01:01:33,320
that even appears anymore anywhere he's

1366
01:01:39,790 --> 01:01:37,880
pretty much been wiped clean family

1367
01:01:41,290 --> 01:01:39,800
doesn't talk about family lied to us a

1368
01:01:42,670 --> 01:01:41,300
couple times we caught him on that and

1369
01:01:44,770 --> 01:01:42,680
it's all in black and white I mean it

1370
01:01:46,240 --> 01:01:44,780
was emails back and forth with family

1371
01:01:49,960 --> 01:01:46,250
members

1372
01:01:51,040 --> 01:01:49,970
the coroner lied to us the police lied

1373
01:01:52,600 --> 01:01:51,050
to us police said they were the

1374
01:01:56,620 --> 01:01:52,610
investigating team turned out they

1375
01:02:01,270 --> 01:01:56,630
weren't the state police were the body

1376
01:02:02,080 --> 01:02:01,280
was in how can I say this the body was

1377
01:02:04,710 --> 01:02:02,090
in horrendous

1378
01:02:11,190 --> 01:02:04,720
shape when it was found it was in the

1379
01:02:13,960 --> 01:02:11,200
advanced stages of decomposition and the

1380
01:02:15,970 --> 01:02:13,970
kicker is that this body was only 20

1381
01:02:19,600 --> 01:02:15,980
yards from the house when it was found

1382
01:02:22,510 --> 01:02:19,610
she's so when cocaine play into this

1383
01:02:25,480 --> 01:02:22,520
whole thing well that's what was given

1384
01:02:28,930 --> 01:02:25,490
as the cause of death and it's a mystery

1385
01:02:30,790 --> 01:02:28,940
because he had no background no I did he

1386
01:02:32,710 --> 01:02:30,800
have no background but when we took call

1387
01:02:34,300 --> 01:02:32,720
with toxicology reports and stuff that

1388
01:02:35,770 --> 01:02:34,310
we have directly from where they came

1389
01:02:38,140 --> 01:02:35,780
were supposed to come from the coroner

1390
01:02:40,360 --> 01:02:38,150
we took all out official paperwork to

1391
01:02:43,000 --> 01:02:40,370
other doctors and pathologist

1392
01:02:44,580 --> 01:02:43,010
they said the amount of cocaine degraded

1393
01:02:47,020 --> 01:02:44,590
cocaine that was in his body

1394
01:02:50,200 --> 01:02:47,030
would have killed him within a matter of

1395
01:02:53,380 --> 01:02:50,210
a couple minutes there's no way he could

1396
01:02:55,900 --> 01:02:53,390
have walked from that ATV back to

1397
01:02:58,500 --> 01:02:55,910
his house and besides that if you have a

1398
01:03:00,400 --> 01:02:58,510
decomposing body in the middle of summer

1399
01:03:04,050 --> 01:03:00,410
laying in your backyard

1400
01:03:06,610 --> 01:03:04,060
20-foot from your backdoor and 15 feet

1401
01:03:08,380 --> 01:03:06,620
from the road that all these searchers

1402
01:03:11,110 --> 01:03:08,390
were driving up and walking up to get to

1403
01:03:14,410 --> 01:03:11,120
the search scene didn't smell this guy

1404
01:03:16,360 --> 01:03:14,420
cadaver dogs I work with cadaver dogs

1405
01:03:19,180 --> 01:03:16,370
they can find a body six foot under dirt

1406
01:03:23,920 --> 01:03:19,190
no problem they can find a body under

1407
01:03:26,460 --> 01:03:23,930
water so dead uh I'm going to say this

1408
01:03:29,110 --> 01:03:26,470
to David Pleiades ever look into this

1409
01:03:30,880 --> 01:03:29,120
now do you know David you know

1410
01:03:32,800 --> 01:03:30,890
yeah yeah I know David very well now

1411
01:03:36,040 --> 01:03:32,810
David is more than the missing persons

1412
01:03:40,180 --> 01:03:36,050
yeah and of it this this guy wasn't

1413
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:40,190
really a missing person but for I forget

1414
01:03:46,540 --> 01:03:42,410
how many hours now off top my head but

1415
01:03:48,940 --> 01:03:46,550
he this is a guy whose background had

1416
01:03:52,750 --> 01:03:48,950
nothing to do with drugs of any types of

1417
01:03:55,480 --> 01:03:52,760
any type and if you wanted to kill this

1418
01:03:57,100 --> 01:03:55,490
guy for whatever reason in that area you

1419
01:03:59,200 --> 01:03:57,110
could walk up in the middle of the night

1420
01:04:01,270 --> 01:03:59,210
or whether he went up there like 5:00

1421
01:04:02,350 --> 01:04:01,280
a.m. or whatever was and shot him in the

1422
01:04:04,030 --> 01:04:02,360
head nobody would have paid any

1423
01:04:06,160 --> 01:04:04,040
attention because the place is loaded

1424
01:04:08,410 --> 01:04:06,170
with rattlesnakes they have the the

1425
01:04:10,030 --> 01:04:08,420
rattlesnake round up there every year so

1426
01:04:12,040 --> 01:04:10,040
gunshots going off day and night in

1427
01:04:13,300 --> 01:04:12,050
those woods means nothing or you could

1428
01:04:17,230 --> 01:04:13,310
have just walked up in him and head with

1429
01:04:20,050 --> 01:04:17,240
a hammer you know yeah so how does how

1430
01:04:22,300 --> 01:04:20,060
does this happen that the guy disappears

1431
01:04:23,920 --> 01:04:22,310
a nobody sees this guy or smells this

1432
01:04:26,530 --> 01:04:23,930
guy well then the family said will it

1433
01:04:27,970 --> 01:04:26,540
rain that day well I was quite quick to

1434
01:04:29,740 --> 01:04:27,980
prove you know I could check that in a

1435
01:04:31,360 --> 01:04:29,750
matter of minutes check that and I said

1436
01:04:33,220 --> 01:04:31,370
yeah it did rain that day she said

1437
01:04:34,810 --> 01:04:33,230
that's why they didn't smell it I said

1438
01:04:36,880 --> 01:04:34,820
well that's a little hard to believe

1439
01:04:41,590 --> 01:04:36,890
because your area for that day only

1440
01:04:44,080 --> 01:04:41,600
received 0.01 inches of rain that

1441
01:04:47,110 --> 01:04:44,090
doesn't even get my windshield wet now

1442
01:04:51,430 --> 01:04:47,120
you know this is this is a becoming

1443
01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:51,440
familiar to me I believe was he liked

1444
01:04:57,370 --> 01:04:53,930
either mangled or something was really

1445
01:05:00,880 --> 01:04:57,380
weird about him as well here's what was

1446
01:05:04,020 --> 01:05:00,890
he like mangled or something no more

1447
01:05:06,910 --> 01:05:04,030
charred someone no in the very very

1448
01:05:07,330 --> 01:05:06,920
first information that came out about

1449
01:05:10,420 --> 01:05:07,340
the

1450
01:05:12,430 --> 01:05:10,430
case was a UFO researcher Peter

1451
01:05:15,820 --> 01:05:12,440
Davenport that was garnering all this

1452
01:05:17,590 --> 01:05:15,830
information from the newspaper and I

1453
01:05:19,210 --> 01:05:17,600
mean the newspaper lady said she was

1454
01:05:21,130 --> 01:05:19,220
even one of the people at in her news

1455
01:05:22,570 --> 01:05:21,140
article original news articles which are

1456
01:05:25,720 --> 01:05:22,580
no longer available she took them all

1457
01:05:27,370 --> 01:05:25,730
off said that she identified him well

1458
01:05:29,110 --> 01:05:27,380
then the chief of police said he

1459
01:05:30,730 --> 01:05:29,120
identified him then the father said he

1460
01:05:34,450 --> 01:05:30,740
identified him then the brother said he

1461
01:05:36,550 --> 01:05:34,460
identified him and then a local police

1462
01:05:38,260 --> 01:05:36,560
officer he he identified so we have all

1463
01:05:40,390 --> 01:05:38,270
these five or six people identified him

1464
01:05:43,000 --> 01:05:40,400
but till this day we do not know who

1465
01:05:46,060 --> 01:05:43,010
identified the body that's really

1466
01:05:47,830 --> 01:05:46,070
strange but and a real attacker case all

1467
01:05:49,270 --> 01:05:47,840
this all his personal information is

1468
01:05:50,170 --> 01:05:49,280
just missing it's gone it's not there

1469
01:05:52,570 --> 01:05:50,180
it's not there

1470
01:05:54,430 --> 01:05:52,580
his a you know on the Social Security

1471
01:05:56,890 --> 01:05:54,440
Death Index which anybody can look up

1472
01:05:58,330 --> 01:05:56,900
look up your grandfather it will have

1473
01:06:00,040 --> 01:05:58,340
who he was married to when he got

1474
01:06:03,430 --> 01:06:00,050
married where he worked where he lived

1475
01:06:06,280 --> 01:06:03,440
uh you know where he was born where he

1476
01:06:07,780 --> 01:06:06,290
went to school and all this information

1477
01:06:10,420 --> 01:06:07,790
how many kids he had the names of the

1478
01:06:11,740 --> 01:06:10,430
kids when they were born that's all in

1479
01:06:15,880 --> 01:06:11,750
the Social Security Death Index you know

1480
01:06:20,320 --> 01:06:15,890
what's on his what a JC's born blah blah

1481
01:06:24,130 --> 01:06:20,330
blah died blah blah blah rest blank very

1482
01:06:26,620 --> 01:06:24,140
unusual that's that's not unusual that's

1483
01:06:29,620 --> 01:06:26,630
outrageous I mean there is nothing about

1484
01:06:32,410 --> 01:06:29,630
this guy now to get to back to the

1485
01:06:38,560 --> 01:06:32,420
beginning of story the day of deciding

1486
01:06:42,100 --> 01:06:38,570
okay a UFO report went in that said that

1487
01:06:44,080 --> 01:06:42,110
there was an object above the power

1488
01:06:46,030 --> 01:06:44,090
lines which is where the ATV was found

1489
01:06:50,340 --> 01:06:46,040
there's a big power lines and runs up

1490
01:06:54,190 --> 01:06:50,350
along his property he has ten acres and

1491
01:06:56,680 --> 01:06:54,200
they two fishermen and one farmer down

1492
01:06:59,260 --> 01:06:56,690
the road say that they see what looks

1493
01:07:02,080 --> 01:06:59,270
like to be a guy in his underwear being

1494
01:07:05,530 --> 01:07:02,090
pulled up into this craft okay and then

1495
01:07:11,470 --> 01:07:05,540
scrap takes off now when he is found

1496
01:07:12,730 --> 01:07:11,480
there are many people saying uh he was

1497
01:07:15,700 --> 01:07:12,740
found like this

1498
01:07:17,650 --> 01:07:15,710
that when he's facing this way in faith

1499
01:07:20,260 --> 01:07:17,660
well in the old times reports tells you

1500
01:07:21,670 --> 01:07:20,270
exactly how he's found he was found in

1501
01:07:23,470 --> 01:07:21,680
his

1502
01:07:27,579 --> 01:07:23,480
cutoff shorts he actually had started

1503
01:07:30,490 --> 01:07:27,589
out with a full body um no what do they

1504
01:07:32,710 --> 01:07:30,500
call them a one-piece suit of camouflage

1505
01:07:35,799 --> 01:07:32,720
because turns out when he's found he is

1506
01:07:40,390 --> 01:07:35,809
found in his cutoff jeans a t-shirt and

1507
01:07:42,730 --> 01:07:40,400
socks so that matches that matches what

1508
01:07:48,460 --> 01:07:42,740
that UFO report said at those gentlemen

1509
01:07:54,240 --> 01:07:48,470
saw now everybody plays off on that says

1510
01:07:56,170 --> 01:07:54,250
well you know this that and whatever and

1511
01:07:58,720 --> 01:07:56,180
I'm just reading some of the comments

1512
01:08:00,280 --> 01:07:58,730
coming across your your thing here it's

1513
01:08:03,940 --> 01:08:00,290
just that the FBI was involved no the

1514
01:08:05,170 --> 01:08:03,950
FBI was not involved and one local law

1515
01:08:07,030 --> 01:08:05,180
enforcement had nothing to do with the

1516
01:08:09,880 --> 01:08:07,040
case whatsoever the case was handled by

1517
01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:09,890
the Pennsylvania State Police right down

1518
01:08:12,849 --> 01:08:11,450
to the viewing of the autopsies and

1519
01:08:18,249 --> 01:08:12,859
taking of evidence from the autopsy

1520
01:08:20,590 --> 01:08:18,259
scene so a lot of stories floated about

1521
01:08:22,240 --> 01:08:20,600
that but I can tell you this when I

1522
01:08:24,189 --> 01:08:22,250
started this investigation I had a

1523
01:08:26,829 --> 01:08:24,199
little half inch binder with about 20

1524
01:08:29,769 --> 01:08:26,839
pages of it I now have two eight-inch

1525
01:08:32,079 --> 01:08:29,779
binders that are filled with with

1526
01:08:34,030 --> 01:08:32,089
documented evidence of what happened who

1527
01:08:36,010 --> 01:08:34,040
said what when it happened who was there

1528
01:08:39,280 --> 01:08:36,020
who wasn't where the body was found

1529
01:08:41,620 --> 01:08:39,290
we've gone to the scene to the house the

1530
01:08:43,450 --> 01:08:41,630
house was taken to sheriff sale after it

1531
01:08:45,280 --> 01:08:43,460
was actually sold by his wife and then

1532
01:08:50,430 --> 01:08:45,290
whoever bought it defaulted on their

1533
01:08:55,450 --> 01:08:53,099
we actually got to walk the property

1534
01:08:58,360 --> 01:08:55,460
photograph and video the property inside

1535
01:09:00,160 --> 01:08:58,370
and out and we found the tree was found

1536
01:09:04,620 --> 01:09:00,170
under it's the only dead tree on the

1537
01:09:09,039 --> 01:09:04,630
property and it's to be exact it's 22.5

1538
01:09:12,400 --> 01:09:09,049
yards from the backdoor yards huh-huh

1539
01:09:14,260 --> 01:09:12,410
and from this road that goes up along

1540
01:09:17,280 --> 01:09:14,270
the house that takes you into the woods

1541
01:09:23,709 --> 01:09:17,290
where he would have went with his ATV to

1542
01:09:26,650 --> 01:09:23,719
go up through there he um what I think

1543
01:09:28,360 --> 01:09:26,660
was 16 feet four inches right edge to

1544
01:09:32,380 --> 01:09:28,370
edge edge of the tree to edge of the

1545
01:09:34,459 --> 01:09:32,390
road now to believe their story or the

1546
01:09:36,620 --> 01:09:34,469
story is being told

1547
01:09:40,009 --> 01:09:36,630
all these researchers had to walk past

1548
01:09:41,479 --> 01:09:40,019
this guy for two days he's in the case

1549
01:09:43,640 --> 01:09:41,489
of advanced decomposition that is

1550
01:09:49,160 --> 01:09:43,650
impossible to happen in that short a

1551
01:09:52,459 --> 01:09:49,170
period of time um early in that way

1552
01:09:55,100 --> 01:09:52,469
doesn't it yeah I mean it's just it's

1553
01:09:59,660 --> 01:09:55,110
it's not it's not it's not strange it's

1554
01:10:02,299 --> 01:09:59,670
bizarre because everybody relates back

1555
01:10:04,040 --> 01:10:02,309
to the original case and even when I

1556
01:10:05,719 --> 01:10:04,050
talked about it originally I was you

1557
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:05,729
know I was wrong because I didn't have

1558
01:10:11,359 --> 01:10:07,610
that information then that I have now I

1559
01:10:13,969 --> 01:10:11,369
didn't talk to people or family members

1560
01:10:15,830 --> 01:10:13,979
or the coroner or the police or the

1561
01:10:17,209 --> 01:10:15,840
State Police or anything like that we

1562
01:10:20,779 --> 01:10:17,219
just had one of our guys up there last

1563
01:10:22,339 --> 01:10:20,789
April the police he went from police

1564
01:10:24,080 --> 01:10:22,349
station to get information on a FOIA

1565
01:10:25,580 --> 01:10:24,090
request that we sent we've not had one

1566
01:10:28,549 --> 01:10:25,590
FOIA request in that Police Department

1567
01:10:30,109 --> 01:10:28,559
answered not one we haven't had one of

1568
01:10:33,259 --> 01:10:30,119
our FOIA requests answered by the state

1569
01:10:34,549 --> 01:10:33,269
police either we've been told that they

1570
01:10:39,319 --> 01:10:34,559
can't give that information out because

1571
01:10:41,870 --> 01:10:39,329
it is an open case now the death has

1572
01:10:43,430 --> 01:10:41,880
been attributed to cocaine toxicity so

1573
01:10:46,969 --> 01:10:43,440
it's not an open case the death has been

1574
01:10:48,410 --> 01:10:46,979
documented as cocaine toxicity so the

1575
01:10:50,919 --> 01:10:48,420
only way you can keep an open case in

1576
01:10:54,830 --> 01:10:50,929
the state of Pennsylvania his murder

1577
01:10:57,439 --> 01:10:54,840
so murder by who now that takes us in

1578
01:10:59,419 --> 01:10:57,449
another direction did he owe somebody

1579
01:11:01,399 --> 01:10:59,429
money was he messing around studies ye

1580
01:11:03,770 --> 01:11:01,409
or but I mean it looks like they went to

1581
01:11:04,790 --> 01:11:03,780
a great length to you know put that much

1582
01:11:07,580 --> 01:11:04,800
cocaine into a guy

1583
01:11:09,080 --> 01:11:07,590
I mean if using cocaine there are

1584
01:11:11,810 --> 01:11:09,090
certain things that happen to the body I

1585
01:11:16,939 --> 01:11:11,820
mean the heart especially the lungs the

1586
01:11:19,580 --> 01:11:16,949
nose different things fail but they they

1587
01:11:21,489 --> 01:11:19,590
show a telltale sign his body was as

1588
01:11:24,049 --> 01:11:21,499
clean as a pin

1589
01:11:26,779 --> 01:11:24,059
other than scrapes and bruises and bangs

1590
01:11:32,419 --> 01:11:26,789
and knocks and a few lacerations the

1591
01:11:34,939 --> 01:11:32,429
body was pretty much undocumented he had

1592
01:11:37,640 --> 01:11:34,949
no signs of enlarged heart or kidney

1593
01:11:40,520 --> 01:11:37,650
issues or liver issues or or nasal

1594
01:11:44,239 --> 01:11:40,530
issues or throat issues but Getty was

1595
01:11:46,609 --> 01:11:44,249
this according to them this wild cocaine

1596
01:11:48,200 --> 01:11:46,619
using fnatic - when we talked to the boy

1597
01:11:50,060 --> 01:11:48,210
scout I mean the

1598
01:11:51,980 --> 01:11:50,070
little league baseball team that he

1599
01:11:53,900 --> 01:11:51,990
coached for many many years they just

1600
01:11:56,330 --> 01:11:53,910
laughed at us and they said look this

1601
01:11:57,770 --> 01:11:56,340
guy even had the slightest inkling of

1602
01:11:59,120 --> 01:11:57,780
doing any kind of drugs do you think

1603
01:11:59,740 --> 01:11:59,130
we'd let him around these kids you're

1604
01:12:03,880 --> 01:11:59,750
crazy

1605
01:12:06,680 --> 01:12:03,890
he said this guy didn't diet cocaine and

1606
01:12:08,090 --> 01:12:06,690
here's the kicker so from the time the

1607
01:12:10,550 --> 01:12:08,100
body's picked up full of time it hits

1608
01:12:14,660 --> 01:12:10,560
the autopsy table we have 14 hours where

1609
01:12:18,290 --> 01:12:14,670
we don't know where that body is well so

1610
01:12:21,380 --> 01:12:18,300
what a crazy case you're telling me man

1611
01:12:23,660 --> 01:12:21,390
Wow and I know we're going into the

1612
01:12:28,190 --> 01:12:23,670
second hour in a little long into this

1613
01:12:30,500 --> 01:12:28,200
but that's fine I wanted to switch gears

1614
01:12:35,450 --> 01:12:30,510
a little bit but also kind of along this

1615
01:12:36,560 --> 01:12:35,460
same subject I want to talk as I

1616
01:12:38,540 --> 01:12:36,570
mentioned in the beginning of the show

1617
01:12:42,080 --> 01:12:38,550
that we're going to go a bit off the UFO

1618
01:12:44,840 --> 01:12:42,090
topic and that is possibly off the UFO

1619
01:12:47,030 --> 01:12:44,850
topic who knows but human mutilations

1620
01:12:49,610 --> 01:12:47,040
kind of similar but before we get into

1621
01:12:51,350 --> 01:12:49,620
that you mentioned that you also do a

1622
01:12:55,630 --> 01:12:51,360
lot of abduction or you do some

1623
01:12:59,570 --> 01:12:55,640
abduction investigations yeah we do that

1624
01:13:02,030 --> 01:12:59,580
to investigate an abduction must be much

1625
01:13:05,480 --> 01:13:02,040
harder to do than a UFO sighting how

1626
01:13:08,660 --> 01:13:05,490
does that work well abduction cases are

1627
01:13:10,390 --> 01:13:08,670
usually I mean an abduction case that

1628
01:13:12,680 --> 01:13:10,400
really catches your your mind our

1629
01:13:15,290 --> 01:13:12,690
abduction cases that usually come from

1630
01:13:16,910 --> 01:13:15,300
folks that all of a sudden have a

1631
01:13:19,340 --> 01:13:16,920
recollection of something that happened

1632
01:13:20,780 --> 01:13:19,350
20 years ago and they're not involved in

1633
01:13:22,700 --> 01:13:20,790
ufology they don't they wouldn't know

1634
01:13:26,900 --> 01:13:22,710
how to go by ufology book an abduction

1635
01:13:28,880 --> 01:13:26,910
book that they had to UM they're

1636
01:13:30,860 --> 01:13:28,890
distraught they're they're pretty much

1637
01:13:35,000 --> 01:13:30,870
physically mentally destroyed by it

1638
01:13:36,530 --> 01:13:35,010
they're very um they know what they saw

1639
01:13:39,640 --> 01:13:36,540
they know what they went through and

1640
01:13:44,000 --> 01:13:39,650
they describe it in very great detail uh

1641
01:13:46,790 --> 01:13:44,010
they don't as I say they don't flutter

1642
01:13:48,860 --> 01:13:46,800
around with descriptions of what they

1643
01:13:51,200 --> 01:13:48,870
thought may have happened to them uh

1644
01:13:56,000 --> 01:13:51,210
they're pretty much right on the money

1645
01:14:00,200 --> 01:13:56,010
and uh a lot of things happen in

1646
01:14:04,140 --> 01:14:00,210
childhood a lot of things happened

1647
01:14:07,380 --> 01:14:04,150
you know that just you just shaking your

1648
01:14:09,270 --> 01:14:07,390
head you know I mean like wow and when

1649
01:14:11,280 --> 01:14:09,280
you do get into one that's a really good

1650
01:14:14,010 --> 01:14:11,290
case you'll find that it wasn't only

1651
01:14:16,260 --> 01:14:14,020
that child that was seemingly abducted

1652
01:14:17,820 --> 01:14:16,270
but it was the brother the sister the

1653
01:14:19,290 --> 01:14:17,830
mother the uncle the father the

1654
01:14:23,729 --> 01:14:19,300
grandfather ran through the whole family

1655
01:14:25,410 --> 01:14:23,739
and it's that's when you start bringing

1656
01:14:27,360 --> 01:14:25,420
in specialists you know I start bringing

1657
01:14:29,070 --> 01:14:27,370
in people that that's all they do you

1658
01:14:31,350 --> 01:14:29,080
know I'll take all the initial stuff and

1659
01:14:33,930 --> 01:14:31,360
then I'll transmit that to one of our

1660
01:14:36,060 --> 01:14:33,940
folks maybe in Florida or Georgia who

1661
01:14:37,800 --> 01:14:36,070
that's all they do and have done for

1662
01:14:40,410 --> 01:14:37,810
many many years and matter of fact

1663
01:14:44,100 --> 01:14:40,420
Denise toner one of the folks that this

1664
01:14:46,890 --> 01:14:44,110
runs our Florida group her and Kathleen

1665
01:14:48,690 --> 01:14:46,900
Martin wrote a book together on

1666
01:14:52,410 --> 01:14:48,700
abductions and she's very active with

1667
01:14:55,560 --> 01:14:52,420
MUFON as an abduction us specialist so I

1668
01:14:57,660 --> 01:14:55,570
really take it so far and then I'll turn

1669
01:15:00,990 --> 01:14:57,670
it over to them and if they're busy then

1670
01:15:04,320 --> 01:15:01,000
it'll go to dr. David Jacobs now when

1671
01:15:08,370 --> 01:15:04,330
you were saying you go through all this

1672
01:15:10,770 --> 01:15:08,380
you hear or I hear everywhere that it's

1673
01:15:13,170 --> 01:15:10,780
like more and more and more people yes

1674
01:15:19,229 --> 01:15:13,180
or class and you're seeing that as well

1675
01:15:21,780 --> 01:15:19,239
yes we've had a about a I'm going to say

1676
01:15:23,700 --> 01:15:21,790
to be on the safe side about a 20

1677
01:15:27,680 --> 01:15:23,710
percent increase in the last two years

1678
01:15:30,720 --> 01:15:27,690
of abduction reports well yeah that's

1679
01:15:33,330 --> 01:15:30,730
that's pretty high pretty happy a lot

1680
01:15:35,220 --> 01:15:33,340
and you know I hear the numbers

1681
01:15:37,940 --> 01:15:35,230
sometimes you hear people say you know

1682
01:15:40,500 --> 01:15:37,950
in the possibly in the millions and just

1683
01:15:43,560 --> 01:15:40,510
you know like a percentage of our

1684
01:15:46,940 --> 01:15:43,570
society you know you hear this and I

1685
01:15:49,050 --> 01:15:46,950
don't know you know even if a small tiny

1686
01:15:51,900 --> 01:15:49,060
person well let's just put it this way

1687
01:15:53,970 --> 01:15:51,910
even if one out of those supposed

1688
01:15:57,060 --> 01:15:53,980
millions actually was abducted

1689
01:16:00,120 --> 01:15:57,070
that would be big-time news well when I

1690
01:16:02,040 --> 01:16:00,130
first started doing uh statistics trying

1691
01:16:05,430 --> 01:16:02,050
to find out just about how many people

1692
01:16:06,960 --> 01:16:05,440
were ever reported missing I mean that

1693
01:16:09,600 --> 01:16:06,970
set me back in my chair I couldn't talk

1694
01:16:11,790 --> 01:16:09,610
for 20 minutes I went back to you

1695
01:16:13,440 --> 01:16:11,800
thousand eight i used the NCIC descent

1696
01:16:13,950 --> 01:16:13,450
statistics which is the National Crime

1697
01:16:16,680 --> 01:16:13,960
Information

1698
01:16:19,140 --> 01:16:16,690
Center put out by the FBI that means

1699
01:16:21,360 --> 01:16:19,150
that that when people see a in their

1700
01:16:23,700 --> 01:16:21,370
newspaper or they might get us a blurb

1701
01:16:25,670 --> 01:16:23,710
or something on the internet they'll say

1702
01:16:28,080 --> 01:16:25,680
that you know that such-and-such town

1703
01:16:29,790 --> 01:16:28,090
here's their crime report for the last

1704
01:16:33,930 --> 01:16:29,800
year while they always run a year behind

1705
01:16:35,370 --> 01:16:33,940
so and on that report which every Police

1706
01:16:38,580 --> 01:16:35,380
Department in this country I don't care

1707
01:16:39,660 --> 01:16:38,590
Sheriff State Police local police it

1708
01:16:41,070 --> 01:16:39,670
doesn't matter if they're law

1709
01:16:43,979 --> 01:16:41,080
enforcement they have to fill this form

1710
01:16:46,310 --> 01:16:43,989
out and on the form it'll ask questions

1711
01:16:48,690 --> 01:16:46,320
it's kind of like yes or no or how many

1712
01:16:50,250 --> 01:16:48,700
how many bicycles were stolen how many

1713
01:16:52,020 --> 01:16:50,260
rapes to jab how many murders occurred

1714
01:16:53,670 --> 01:16:52,030
how many gun thefts to jab you know that

1715
01:16:56,720 --> 01:16:53,680
kind of stuff and that's how they tally

1716
01:16:59,970 --> 01:16:56,730
the crime statistics for the country

1717
01:17:01,050 --> 01:16:59,980
okay pretty simple and also on there is

1718
01:17:03,450 --> 01:17:01,060
missing persons reports

1719
01:17:05,220 --> 01:17:03,460
murders runaways the whole bit so I went

1720
01:17:07,320 --> 01:17:05,230
back and researched that it's open to

1721
01:17:14,130 --> 01:17:07,330
the public anybody can do it so I

1722
01:17:16,650 --> 01:17:14,140
started in 1991 and I actually started I

1723
01:17:18,510 --> 01:17:16,660
did the first research in 2008 and I

1724
01:17:20,670 --> 01:17:18,520
came up with it had seven hundred

1725
01:17:24,270 --> 01:17:20,680
seventy eight thousand 164 missing

1726
01:17:26,580 --> 01:17:24,280
persons filed now 95 percent of those

1727
01:17:29,459 --> 01:17:26,590
are found not like David asked about

1728
01:17:31,290 --> 01:17:29,469
that okay about 95 percent are found not

1729
01:17:34,709 --> 01:17:31,300
like David's part were pretty much

1730
01:17:36,350 --> 01:17:34,719
nobody's ever found and now about 75% of

1731
01:17:39,390 --> 01:17:36,360
those are runaways under the age of 18

1732
01:17:42,180 --> 01:17:39,400
about 20 percent are spousal abuse

1733
01:17:44,340 --> 01:17:42,190
murders elderly walkaways ransom you

1734
01:17:47,640 --> 01:17:44,350
know kidnapping that kind stuff but five

1735
01:17:58,290 --> 01:17:47,650
percent 5% are never found so that just

1736
01:18:00,930 --> 01:17:58,300
for 2008 that means that $38,988 missing

1737
01:18:02,459 --> 01:18:00,940
reports from 1991 and that came up to

1738
01:18:05,130 --> 01:18:02,469
thirteen million eight hundred sixty one

1739
01:18:06,800 --> 01:18:05,140
thousand sixty-five using the same math

1740
01:18:09,330 --> 01:18:06,810
with that 5%

1741
01:18:12,030 --> 01:18:09,340
it showed that six hundred ninety three

1742
01:18:15,420 --> 01:18:12,040
thousand fifty-three people are never

1743
01:18:16,979 --> 01:18:15,430
found no trace man woman child no

1744
01:18:19,440 --> 01:18:16,989
clothing no body no nothing

1745
01:18:21,540 --> 01:18:19,450
they were found like five years later

1746
01:18:23,700 --> 01:18:21,550
would it you know like living somewhere

1747
01:18:27,530 --> 01:18:23,710
yep it would take it off it would take

1748
01:18:31,190 --> 01:18:27,540
off yeah well Oh in 17 years

1749
01:18:35,390 --> 01:18:31,200
you had 40,000 795 people gone off the

1750
01:18:37,760 --> 01:18:35,400
face of this planet totally amazing and

1751
01:18:41,480 --> 01:18:37,770
someone could be say murdered and buried

1752
01:18:43,190 --> 01:18:41,490
or something like yeah yeah yeah but the

1753
01:18:43,790 --> 01:18:43,200
five percent means that they've never

1754
01:18:50,180 --> 01:18:43,800
been found

1755
01:18:54,230 --> 01:18:50,190
no body no parts no clothing no nothing

1756
01:18:57,020 --> 01:18:54,240
and we're not talking about criminals

1757
01:19:00,470 --> 01:18:57,030
here or wild maniacs or anything I we're

1758
01:19:02,660 --> 01:19:00,480
talking about everyday people so now the

1759
01:19:04,700 --> 01:19:02,670
United States does this to the FBI but

1760
01:19:07,400 --> 01:19:04,710
now take a country like say South Africa

1761
01:19:08,960 --> 01:19:07,410
ours just Africa where whole villages

1762
01:19:11,330 --> 01:19:08,970
have disappeared they don't take any

1763
01:19:13,190 --> 01:19:11,340
statistics so well there were 50 people

1764
01:19:15,770 --> 01:19:13,200
in that villager 5,000 people in a

1765
01:19:18,350 --> 01:19:15,780
village they're gone

1766
01:19:20,150 --> 01:19:18,360
China doesn't do it I mean places that

1767
01:19:22,550 --> 01:19:20,160
had this Europe nobody in Europe does

1768
01:19:25,520 --> 01:19:22,560
this so they have no idea how many

1769
01:19:27,310 --> 01:19:25,530
people are missing so if you look at the

1770
01:19:33,350 --> 01:19:27,320
forty thousand seven hundred a year

1771
01:19:36,440 --> 01:19:33,360
since 1991 what's that say about the

1772
01:19:39,890 --> 01:19:36,450
rest of the world I mean that's crazy

1773
01:19:43,250 --> 01:19:39,900
yeah yeah it's amazing really is and it

1774
01:19:44,390 --> 01:19:43,260
it's pretty scary actually yesterday to

1775
01:19:47,870 --> 01:19:44,400
think about it

1776
01:19:50,270 --> 01:19:47,880
so now I heard one of the lectures I

1777
01:19:54,620 --> 01:19:50,280
listen to what you were talking about

1778
01:19:56,510 --> 01:19:54,630
you got into the human mutilations and

1779
01:19:59,650 --> 01:19:56,520
where do you think the connections how

1780
01:20:02,530 --> 01:19:59,660
does all that fit into everything well

1781
01:20:06,380 --> 01:20:02,540
back in the early 60s

1782
01:20:08,390 --> 01:20:06,390
rumors were all about you know they came

1783
01:20:12,530 --> 01:20:08,400
to the forefront of human corpses were

1784
01:20:15,050 --> 01:20:12,540
being found with strange wounds like the

1785
01:20:18,080 --> 01:20:15,060
type the same type found in cattle

1786
01:20:19,730 --> 01:20:18,090
cattle mutilations and they were just

1787
01:20:21,530 --> 01:20:19,740
dismissed as in bad taste by most

1788
01:20:24,680 --> 01:20:21,540
ufologist nobody want to get involved in

1789
01:20:26,890 --> 01:20:24,690
that until today is so the black part of

1790
01:20:29,420 --> 01:20:26,900
ufology that's really never talked about

1791
01:20:30,980 --> 01:20:29,430
but I started looking into it because I

1792
01:20:32,840 --> 01:20:30,990
was looking at actually cattle

1793
01:20:35,300 --> 01:20:32,850
mutilations and I started coming up with

1794
01:20:37,820 --> 01:20:35,310
all these cases I felt like well there's

1795
01:20:39,500 --> 01:20:37,830
a lot of cases here so the one that

1796
01:20:41,820 --> 01:20:39,510
really struck home right off the get-go

1797
01:20:45,510 --> 01:20:41,830
is a Guate prying a dam and

1798
01:20:49,170 --> 01:20:45,520
Zil case and took place in 1988 the

1799
01:20:53,850 --> 01:20:49,180
guada prank dam is a man-made dam that

1800
01:20:57,510 --> 01:20:53,860
supplies water to San Paolo a very great

1801
01:20:59,310 --> 01:20:57,520
fishing spot for the locals also so

1802
01:21:01,350 --> 01:20:59,320
couple guys in a boat brought doing

1803
01:21:03,630 --> 01:21:01,360
their fishing thing and they spot what

1804
01:21:06,510 --> 01:21:03,640
they see is a body looks like a body on

1805
01:21:08,250 --> 01:21:06,520
the shore so instead of being like most

1806
01:21:12,060 --> 01:21:08,260
people would go check it out these guys

1807
01:21:14,420 --> 01:21:12,070
went and got the cops so the cops showed

1808
01:21:16,740 --> 01:21:14,430
up and they show up with a forensic team

1809
01:21:20,160 --> 01:21:16,750
yay for our side that doesn't usually

1810
01:21:24,450 --> 01:21:20,170
happen so at the crime scene

1811
01:21:27,330 --> 01:21:24,460
this guy is found with the following

1812
01:21:31,080 --> 01:21:27,340
items surgically removed his eyes his

1813
01:21:34,050 --> 01:21:31,090
left ear is inner ear lower jaw inner

1814
01:21:35,460 --> 01:21:34,060
throat and tongue there are one inch to

1815
01:21:37,050 --> 01:21:35,470
one and a half inch holes in the

1816
01:21:39,960 --> 01:21:37,060
following areas of his body which were

1817
01:21:42,630 --> 01:21:39,970
the muscle tissue glands all removed

1818
01:21:44,760 --> 01:21:42,640
shoulder chest navel thigh testicles

1819
01:21:48,050 --> 01:21:44,770
removed prostrate Granberry prostrate

1820
01:21:50,400 --> 01:21:48,060
gland was removed via the urethral tube

1821
01:21:52,350 --> 01:21:50,410
intestines were removed via a hole in

1822
01:21:55,050 --> 01:21:52,360
the navel anus was cored out to the

1823
01:21:56,700 --> 01:21:55,060
colon Bobby presented no signs of

1824
01:21:57,420 --> 01:21:56,710
bloating which in itself I think is

1825
01:21:59,250 --> 01:21:57,430
pretty remarkable

1826
01:22:01,410 --> 01:21:59,260
due to the heat in that area at that

1827
01:22:03,420 --> 01:22:01,420
time of year he should have been blown

1828
01:22:06,150 --> 01:22:03,430
up like a balloon and there was no body

1829
01:22:08,910 --> 01:22:06,160
odor whatsoever neither was there any

1830
01:22:10,830 --> 01:22:08,920
blood found at the scene of and some

1831
01:22:19,290 --> 01:22:10,840
speckles of blood around the round the

1832
01:22:20,910 --> 01:22:19,300
wounds themselves he is laying there all

1833
01:22:22,770 --> 01:22:20,920
the photos are taken the body was never

1834
01:22:25,140 --> 01:22:22,780
touched til everything was done so it

1835
01:22:29,250 --> 01:22:25,150
was really done properly in the right

1836
01:22:32,940 --> 01:22:29,260
order and then we get the autopsy report

1837
01:22:35,790 --> 01:22:32,950
which was made public years before yours

1838
01:22:38,340 --> 01:22:35,800
afterwards and the death was due to

1839
01:22:41,010 --> 01:22:38,350
massive trauma now that I guess so the

1840
01:22:44,010 --> 01:22:41,020
really strange parts about this is just

1841
01:22:47,280 --> 01:22:44,020
the opposite of Todd sees this guy was

1842
01:22:48,870 --> 01:22:47,290
Todd was dead 42 I forget 40 to 44 so

1843
01:22:51,180 --> 01:22:48,880
I'm like at 50 hours or something like

1844
01:22:53,850 --> 01:22:51,190
that but the time of death placed on

1845
01:22:55,180 --> 01:22:53,860
this guy was 40 to 70 72 hours before

1846
01:22:59,410 --> 01:22:55,190
discovery

1847
01:23:01,450 --> 01:22:59,420
no no bloating no livor mortis no rigor

1848
01:23:05,170 --> 01:23:01,460
mortis no noticeable blood at the scene

1849
01:23:11,560 --> 01:23:05,180
and one of the things that pops up in

1850
01:23:15,820 --> 01:23:11,570
the autopsy report is the term vital

1851
01:23:17,530 --> 01:23:15,830
reaction now vital reaction would use a

1852
01:23:19,360 --> 01:23:17,540
lot of lawyers police use that because

1853
01:23:21,790 --> 01:23:19,370
vital the term vital reaction really

1854
01:23:23,950 --> 01:23:21,800
indicates the response of a living body

1855
01:23:25,090 --> 01:23:23,960
tissue to an injury so if I take a knife

1856
01:23:26,590 --> 01:23:25,100
and I stab you in the arm you're going

1857
01:23:27,670 --> 01:23:26,600
to pull away well when you pull away

1858
01:23:29,979 --> 01:23:27,680
you're going to cause some ripping

1859
01:23:33,970 --> 01:23:29,989
tearing blacking blue around the wound

1860
01:23:37,450 --> 01:23:33,980
and stuff like that and it's really a

1861
01:23:39,790 --> 01:23:37,460
importance in forensic medicine it was

1862
01:23:42,310 --> 01:23:39,800
it really it helps to attempt to

1863
01:23:44,170 --> 01:23:42,320
establish that an injury was inflicted

1864
01:23:45,459 --> 01:23:44,180
before death or after death so in other

1865
01:23:46,720 --> 01:23:45,469
words if you're dead and I take a knife

1866
01:23:48,670 --> 01:23:46,730
and stick it it's going to be a hole

1867
01:23:52,410 --> 01:23:48,680
from the knife no blood no bleeding no

1868
01:23:56,320 --> 01:23:52,420
black and blue or anything like that but

1869
01:24:00,670 --> 01:23:56,330
one of the things that vital reaction

1870
01:24:02,380 --> 01:24:00,680
does mean is that in this case when they

1871
01:24:04,900 --> 01:24:02,390
did the autopsy when they removed the

1872
01:24:07,860 --> 01:24:04,910
skull they saw massive hematomas many

1873
01:24:13,930 --> 01:24:07,870
hematomas very small but many of them

1874
01:24:16,150 --> 01:24:13,940
that would only be found in a very like

1875
01:24:18,430 --> 01:24:16,160
say a crushing injury where somebody was

1876
01:24:19,660 --> 01:24:18,440
pinned in a car or crushed against a

1877
01:24:21,370 --> 01:24:19,670
wall with a piece of machinery they

1878
01:24:22,900 --> 01:24:21,380
didn't die right away they were alive in

1879
01:24:24,250 --> 01:24:22,910
all this pain you know they're going

1880
01:24:26,080 --> 01:24:24,260
through all this pain agony in their

1881
01:24:28,830 --> 01:24:26,090
brain you know and all of a sudden these

1882
01:24:34,420 --> 01:24:28,840
small blood vessels start to burst and

1883
01:24:37,479 --> 01:24:34,430
uh that really means that when this took

1884
01:24:38,860 --> 01:24:37,489
place when this guy was I'll use

1885
01:24:44,620 --> 01:24:38,870
butchered for a better adhesive any

1886
01:24:47,920 --> 01:24:44,630
other word he was alive oh now we have

1887
01:24:49,780 --> 01:24:47,930
one animal mutilation like that the case

1888
01:24:51,430 --> 01:24:49,790
of snippy I can remember snippy's real

1889
01:24:54,130 --> 01:24:51,440
name but that was the name the newspaper

1890
01:24:55,510 --> 01:24:54,140
okay this this this horse the

1891
01:24:59,590 --> 01:24:55,520
investigators are on the scene and

1892
01:25:00,760 --> 01:24:59,600
horses laying on his side and the one

1893
01:25:03,939 --> 01:25:00,770
investigator says there's something

1894
01:25:05,620 --> 01:25:03,949
strange here he says in his words he

1895
01:25:08,250 --> 01:25:05,630
said you know the eyes were removed and

1896
01:25:09,750 --> 01:25:08,260
the viscous fluid should have

1897
01:25:10,890 --> 01:25:09,760
off the horse laying on the slept it

1898
01:25:13,439 --> 01:25:10,900
should have ran off to the left side

1899
01:25:15,000 --> 01:25:13,449
correct and the guy goes yeah he said

1900
01:25:17,310 --> 01:25:15,010
well look at this and he's looking at

1901
01:25:19,770 --> 01:25:17,320
the horse and the viscous fluid actually

1902
01:25:22,229 --> 01:25:19,780
ran straight down the nose and pause the

1903
01:25:24,890 --> 01:25:22,239
end of the nose so the horse was upright

1904
01:25:30,089 --> 01:25:24,900
when his eyes were removed

1905
01:25:32,629 --> 01:25:30,099
she's so the horse was alive God now

1906
01:25:35,100 --> 01:25:32,639
there's a researcher in Puerto Rico

1907
01:25:37,290 --> 01:25:35,110
who's working on this now for about I

1908
01:25:39,919 --> 01:25:37,300
don't know how many years probably allow

1909
01:25:43,890 --> 01:25:39,929
holding them alive maybe and he says uh

1910
01:25:49,560 --> 01:25:43,900
he thinks that the our space brethren

1911
01:25:52,290 --> 01:25:49,570
are going after endorphins now what

1912
01:25:55,620 --> 01:25:52,300
causes endorphins if I run up to you and

1913
01:25:57,689 --> 01:25:55,630
I say damn Martin here's a million

1914
01:25:59,669 --> 01:25:57,699
dollar check it's all yours cash just go

1915
01:26:02,459 --> 01:25:59,679
spend it your endorphins are going to go

1916
01:26:03,899 --> 01:26:02,469
nuts right they're just the same yeah it

1917
01:26:06,299 --> 01:26:03,909
happened same thing would happen if I

1918
01:26:08,399 --> 01:26:06,309
put your hand and meat in a vise and

1919
01:26:10,950 --> 01:26:08,409
start to turn the vise closed your

1920
01:26:14,490 --> 01:26:10,960
endorphins would go crazy so it's a good

1921
01:26:18,000 --> 01:26:14,500
reaction bad reaction and he's trying to

1922
01:26:20,640 --> 01:26:18,010
put this together with these human

1923
01:26:22,319 --> 01:26:20,650
mutilations now there are a number of

1924
01:26:25,259 --> 01:26:22,329
mutilations that have taken place I mean

1925
01:26:27,120 --> 01:26:25,269
there's a number of cases they've had

1926
01:26:29,850 --> 01:26:27,130
them they've been documented back in

1927
01:26:32,490 --> 01:26:29,860
over in England back into the 14th 15th

1928
01:26:35,669 --> 01:26:32,500
century where they found of you know a

1929
01:26:37,500 --> 01:26:35,679
local who disappeared in 24 hours later

1930
01:26:39,600 --> 01:26:37,510
somebody found them hanging in a tree

1931
01:26:42,060 --> 01:26:39,610
and he had these strange holes in his

1932
01:26:49,370 --> 01:26:42,070
body and parts of the body interior were

1933
01:26:56,160 --> 01:26:51,689
another case that was really fascinating

1934
01:26:57,740 --> 01:26:56,170
I did get to talk to the the lawyer that

1935
01:27:03,000 --> 01:26:57,750
was handling the case for the gentleman

1936
01:27:05,220 --> 01:27:03,010
was in Cairo Egypt in an area called

1937
01:27:07,290 --> 01:27:05,230
Beni Mazar which is right outside of

1938
01:27:10,049 --> 01:27:07,300
Cairo this took place in 2005 where

1939
01:27:12,720 --> 01:27:10,059
three families were butchered exactly

1940
01:27:14,939 --> 01:27:12,730
like this guy every everything in the

1941
01:27:16,770 --> 01:27:14,949
house was butchered I think at that

1942
01:27:18,629 --> 01:27:16,780
goldfish they were butchered everything

1943
01:27:21,370 --> 01:27:18,639
was gone everybody was killed man women

1944
01:27:24,580 --> 01:27:21,380
children dogs cats whatever

1945
01:27:27,010 --> 01:27:24,590
and they blamed it on a gentleman who

1946
01:27:28,540 --> 01:27:27,020
was [\h__\h] mentally [\h__\h] had to

1947
01:27:31,210 --> 01:27:28,550
had the mentality of about a four or

1948
01:27:34,930 --> 01:27:31,220
five year old didn't even know his own

1949
01:27:37,390 --> 01:27:34,940
name lived 35 miles from the scene of

1950
01:27:40,090 --> 01:27:37,400
the crime and they pinned the crime on

1951
01:27:43,600 --> 01:27:40,100
him well they had no other suspect so he

1952
01:27:43,960 --> 01:27:43,610
was likely and that case drug on for

1953
01:27:46,060 --> 01:27:43,970
years

1954
01:27:48,910 --> 01:27:46,070
and then finally you know they got him

1955
01:27:52,150 --> 01:27:48,920
acquitted and I did get to talk to his

1956
01:27:55,060 --> 01:27:52,160
lawyer until this day till right now if

1957
01:27:56,890 --> 01:27:55,070
this guy wants to go outside I don't

1958
01:27:58,270 --> 01:27:56,900
care if he wants to go outside of his

1959
01:27:59,710 --> 01:27:58,280
property line you know he wants to

1960
01:28:01,990 --> 01:27:59,720
outside that wall take a walk on the

1961
01:28:03,580 --> 01:28:02,000
street they have to call the police a

1962
01:28:05,260 --> 01:28:03,590
police officer will come and escort him

1963
01:28:09,970 --> 01:28:05,270
if he's going to go to the mosque to

1964
01:28:11,230 --> 01:28:09,980
pray please shopping police and if he

1965
01:28:13,720 --> 01:28:11,240
doesn't call police he goes outside

1966
01:28:14,320 --> 01:28:13,730
those parameters he will be locked up

1967
01:28:17,290 --> 01:28:14,330
for life

1968
01:28:20,650 --> 01:28:17,300
and this is someone who was acquitted he

1969
01:28:22,360 --> 01:28:20,660
was acquitted yes unreal but those were

1970
01:28:23,980 --> 01:28:22,370
the conditions of him being acquitted I

1971
01:28:28,090 --> 01:28:23,990
think yeah these things have to take

1972
01:28:30,150 --> 01:28:28,100
place till he dies Wow

1973
01:28:34,030 --> 01:28:30,160
it's a guy can't even tie his own shoes

1974
01:28:36,040 --> 01:28:34,040
yeah in 35 miles away that's 35 miles

1975
01:28:39,010 --> 01:28:36,050
away he has to have help to eat to go to

1976
01:28:41,980 --> 01:28:39,020
the bathroom to take a bath I mean this

1977
01:28:46,300 --> 01:28:41,990
guy is basically a walk-in bowl of

1978
01:28:47,740 --> 01:28:46,310
vegetable soup and they to do what to do

1979
01:28:51,160 --> 01:28:47,750
all the things that were done to the guy

1980
01:28:53,190 --> 01:28:51,170
in Brazil or like are done to cattle

1981
01:28:56,320 --> 01:28:53,200
which are pretty much exactly the same

1982
01:29:00,640 --> 01:28:56,330
same organs take in the same parts all

1983
01:29:05,590 --> 01:29:00,650
taken the same way bingo there's a guy

1984
01:29:08,130 --> 01:29:05,600
nailed with now I have heard I don't

1985
01:29:11,110 --> 01:29:08,140
think anyone has talked about the human

1986
01:29:13,530 --> 01:29:11,120
mutilations on this show I've had a

1987
01:29:16,090 --> 01:29:13,540
Chris O'Brien and a few other people

1988
01:29:18,160 --> 01:29:16,100
Linda Moulton Howe I think talked about

1989
01:29:20,860 --> 01:29:18,170
a little bit on the show before but is

1990
01:29:22,810 --> 01:29:20,870
there so one of the things that Chris

1991
01:29:26,320 --> 01:29:22,820
O'Brien said a lot of times there is

1992
01:29:28,240 --> 01:29:26,330
blood in the corpse of the cattle is

1993
01:29:32,650 --> 01:29:28,250
just everything you know settles to

1994
01:29:34,900 --> 01:29:32,660
gravity yes but but not that but I mean

1995
01:29:36,430 --> 01:29:34,910
if you've ever seen a cow butchered

1996
01:29:38,080 --> 01:29:36,440
you won't believe the amount of blood

1997
01:29:39,790 --> 01:29:38,090
that comes out of that RA I went to a

1998
01:29:41,140 --> 01:29:39,800
navitor just to see it to see because I

1999
01:29:44,470 --> 01:29:41,150
never seen it before so I went to see it

2000
01:29:46,660 --> 01:29:44,480
when they open that animal up I mean the

2001
01:29:50,350 --> 01:29:46,670
floor which is probably in a room about

2002
01:29:52,950 --> 01:29:50,360
16 by 18 is covered in blood from one

2003
01:29:56,320 --> 01:29:52,960
animal hope no one's eating right now

2004
01:29:58,240 --> 01:29:56,330
yeah but you have Chuck Kowski who's a

2005
01:29:59,230 --> 01:29:58,250
longtime researcher remember MUFON is as

2006
01:30:02,320 --> 01:29:59,240
a matter of fact he's the cattle

2007
01:30:04,690 --> 01:30:02,330
researcher for a MUFON and Chuck has

2008
01:30:06,700 --> 01:30:04,700
also found you know small pools of blood

2009
01:30:08,950 --> 01:30:06,710
here and there but that stuff that's

2010
01:30:10,870 --> 01:30:08,960
draining out of small veins I mean we're

2011
01:30:12,280 --> 01:30:10,880
not talking about we're talking about an

2012
01:30:15,160 --> 01:30:12,290
animal that's been you know opened up

2013
01:30:18,670 --> 01:30:15,170
front/rear top bottom and you got this

2014
01:30:19,840 --> 01:30:18,680
little cup or so of blood well what

2015
01:30:22,660 --> 01:30:19,850
happened to the gallons that were in

2016
01:30:25,570 --> 01:30:22,670
there they're not on the ground they're

2017
01:30:28,720 --> 01:30:25,580
not on the ground and places where these

2018
01:30:31,750 --> 01:30:28,730
animals have been found years many years

2019
01:30:34,570 --> 01:30:31,760
have gone by where you can go to that

2020
01:30:36,550 --> 01:30:34,580
exact spot and nothing is growing there

2021
01:30:38,680 --> 01:30:36,560
I mean it could be in the middle of a

2022
01:30:40,870 --> 01:30:38,690
wheat field and and that that that

2023
01:30:42,960 --> 01:30:40,880
animal carcass weren't laid there's

2024
01:30:47,470 --> 01:30:42,970
nothing growing where that carcass laid

2025
01:30:49,360 --> 01:30:47,480
so uh you know it did although there are

2026
01:30:53,740 --> 01:30:49,370
not many researchers at Duke Allen

2027
01:30:55,360 --> 01:30:53,750
mutilation they pretty much all have the

2028
01:30:58,990 --> 01:30:55,370
same thing gone as far as what they do

2029
01:31:00,940 --> 01:30:59,000
and one of the things chuck was really

2030
01:31:03,430 --> 01:31:00,950
excited about was he had an EMF detector

2031
01:31:06,640 --> 01:31:03,440
and he was actually getting a hit on a

2032
01:31:08,290 --> 01:31:06,650
cow recently recently killed and he was

2033
01:31:10,030 --> 01:31:08,300
this thing was moving whatever it was

2034
01:31:13,180 --> 01:31:10,040
inside this cow's body was moving and he

2035
01:31:14,770 --> 01:31:13,190
was picking it up on the EMF detector so

2036
01:31:17,170 --> 01:31:14,780
there was something electromagnetic in

2037
01:31:18,940 --> 01:31:17,180
that cow that was moving around in that

2038
01:31:22,840 --> 01:31:18,950
cow and when he got to the other side it

2039
01:31:24,100 --> 01:31:22,850
disappeared just anyone that really

2040
01:31:27,040 --> 01:31:24,110
started there wasn't there anymore

2041
01:31:29,020 --> 01:31:27,050
stranger and stranger now wonder what

2042
01:31:32,070 --> 01:31:29,030
are you you mentioned that there's a lot

2043
01:31:36,070 --> 01:31:32,080
of similarities between human

2044
01:31:39,280 --> 01:31:36,080
mutilations and cattle yes and while the

2045
01:31:43,630 --> 01:31:39,290
anal area is report out the ears are

2046
01:31:45,280 --> 01:31:43,640
cuttin eyes are missing lower jaw one of

2047
01:31:47,890 --> 01:31:45,290
the strangest cases I worked on was

2048
01:31:50,410 --> 01:31:47,900
actually a horse in North Dakota

2049
01:31:52,240 --> 01:31:50,420
where a lady was riding in an indoor

2050
01:31:55,300 --> 01:31:52,250
ring if anybody's familiar with riding

2051
01:31:57,669 --> 01:31:55,310
horses an inner ring they those rings

2052
01:31:58,870 --> 01:31:57,679
are pristine there's no sharp objects or

2053
01:32:00,729 --> 01:31:58,880
anything like that they're very smooth

2054
01:32:04,330 --> 01:32:00,739
so the rider or the animal does not get

2055
01:32:06,100 --> 01:32:04,340
hurt so she stops the horse in the

2056
01:32:07,990 --> 01:32:06,110
middle of her little thing to go get

2057
01:32:09,880 --> 01:32:08,000
something out of the tack room the tack

2058
01:32:13,479 --> 01:32:09,890
room is 75 feet from where she left the

2059
01:32:15,580 --> 01:32:13,489
horse standing okay when she comes back

2060
01:32:17,649 --> 01:32:15,590
how long it takes to walk 75 feet got

2061
01:32:19,990 --> 01:32:17,659
whatever she got and came back but when

2062
01:32:23,500 --> 01:32:20,000
she comes back the horses jaw is opened

2063
01:32:24,220 --> 01:32:23,510
up from right below the ear all the way

2064
01:32:26,020 --> 01:32:24,230
down

2065
01:32:29,140 --> 01:32:26,030
it's the flap is hanging open and the

2066
01:32:31,090 --> 01:32:29,150
lower part of its jaw is missing the

2067
01:32:32,680 --> 01:32:31,100
horse is bleeding very little the horse

2068
01:32:35,280 --> 01:32:32,690
is not screaming it's not running around

2069
01:32:37,660 --> 01:32:35,290
it's standing exactly where she left it

2070
01:32:38,919 --> 01:32:37,670
they call a vet that says there's

2071
01:32:41,229 --> 01:32:38,929
nothing I can do for this horse they had

2072
01:32:43,300 --> 01:32:41,239
to put the horse down and when she sent

2073
01:32:44,250 --> 01:32:43,310
me those pictures I just I couldn't

2074
01:32:47,439 --> 01:32:44,260
believe it

2075
01:32:50,050 --> 01:32:47,449
so right away somebody said while he ran

2076
01:32:51,729 --> 01:32:50,060
into a nail well there are no nails in a

2077
01:32:53,080 --> 01:32:51,739
riding rink there's nothing in a riding

2078
01:32:55,780 --> 01:32:53,090
ring that would injure a horse or a

2079
01:32:57,520 --> 01:32:55,790
rider because you know you're riding

2080
01:33:01,479 --> 01:32:57,530
around in a ring there's nothing there

2081
01:33:03,070 --> 01:33:01,489
there's walls and her smooth walls will

2082
01:33:05,110 --> 01:33:03,080
either wood or metal or whatever but

2083
01:33:06,370 --> 01:33:05,120
there's no place where the horse went I

2084
01:33:09,640 --> 01:33:06,380
mean the horse was right where she left

2085
01:33:12,250 --> 01:33:09,650
him and he never let out a howl or

2086
01:33:13,660 --> 01:33:12,260
scream or I mean that just doesn't make

2087
01:33:16,030 --> 01:33:13,670
him eat slop before you slap a horse

2088
01:33:18,220 --> 01:33:16,040
good with a stick that horse is going to

2089
01:33:19,540 --> 01:33:18,230
yell yeah now imagine this horse to

2090
01:33:22,899 --> 01:33:19,550
stand there while somebody removes its

2091
01:33:24,310 --> 01:33:22,909
lower jaw and opens it up I mean this

2092
01:33:29,350 --> 01:33:24,320
horse is opened up like it was hit with

2093
01:33:31,060 --> 01:33:29,360
a saber so that is crazy now I think

2094
01:33:33,820 --> 01:33:31,070
there's a couple of grands up on the

2095
01:33:36,939 --> 01:33:33,830
message board and one is so what does

2096
01:33:40,540 --> 01:33:36,949
the EMF detector mean that would be

2097
01:33:41,830 --> 01:33:40,550
moving inside the cow the only thing

2098
01:33:43,780 --> 01:33:41,840
that it would that chucks

2099
01:33:47,100 --> 01:33:43,790
thing was that there was something

2100
01:33:50,530 --> 01:33:47,110
giving off an electric magnetic pulse I

2101
01:33:52,450 --> 01:33:50,540
could have been anything I mean okay

2102
01:33:54,610 --> 01:33:52,460
your microwave will give off EMF your

2103
01:33:57,149 --> 01:33:54,620
watch will give off EMF your your

2104
01:33:59,169 --> 01:33:57,159
monitor will give off EMF let

2105
01:34:00,129 --> 01:33:59,179
electromagnetic fields are everywhere

2106
01:34:01,150 --> 01:34:00,139
but why would there be an

2107
01:34:04,650 --> 01:34:01,160
electromagnetic

2108
01:34:07,840 --> 01:34:04,660
killed in a cow yeah it's pretty weird I

2109
01:34:10,510 --> 01:34:07,850
mean there's no natural anomaly that

2110
01:34:13,960 --> 01:34:10,520
could be associated with that inside of

2111
01:34:15,580 --> 01:34:13,970
like a living being no no you can take

2112
01:34:18,250 --> 01:34:15,590
an EMF detector unless you have a heart

2113
01:34:19,960 --> 01:34:18,260
unless you have a pacemaker an EMF Ector

2114
01:34:21,430 --> 01:34:19,970
will just give just like radiation if I

2115
01:34:22,840 --> 01:34:21,440
put a radiation detector against your

2116
01:34:24,070 --> 01:34:22,850
body I'm just going to pick up residual

2117
01:34:25,720 --> 01:34:24,080
radiation which could be from your

2118
01:34:29,800 --> 01:34:25,730
clothing from the air or anything else

2119
01:34:31,810 --> 01:34:29,810
but to make an EMF detector move there

2120
01:34:38,050 --> 01:34:31,820
has to be a electromagnetic pulse

2121
01:34:41,800 --> 01:34:38,060
I see Wow electromagnetic pulse in a in

2122
01:34:44,020 --> 01:34:41,810
a cow that was dead amazing so Phil asks

2123
01:34:44,860 --> 01:34:44,030
on the message board how many human

2124
01:34:49,090 --> 01:34:44,870
mutilations

2125
01:34:50,830 --> 01:34:49,100
have there been reported a date best we

2126
01:34:52,450 --> 01:34:50,840
know we don't have a whole lot from

2127
01:34:55,900 --> 01:34:52,460
England other than the fact that they

2128
01:34:58,330 --> 01:34:55,910
gave us like seven cases to look at in

2129
01:35:03,760 --> 01:34:58,340
this country I can tell you that in a

2130
01:35:06,940 --> 01:35:03,770
second here I believe it's ten one two

2131
01:35:12,390 --> 01:35:06,950
three four five six seven eight nine 10

2132
01:35:16,150 --> 01:35:12,400
11 11 in this connect and guess and

2133
01:35:20,950 --> 01:35:16,160
Arthur variances or they just a lot of

2134
01:35:23,500 --> 01:35:20,960
similarities pretty much similar the one

2135
01:35:29,500 --> 01:35:23,510
that would be closest to the gentleman

2136
01:35:31,180 --> 01:35:29,510
in Brazil was New Zealand case in 1994

2137
01:35:33,490 --> 01:35:31,190
Road gentleman was found basically

2138
01:35:38,910 --> 01:35:33,500
identically cut up just like this other

2139
01:35:47,170 --> 01:35:43,440
they go back to 1956 in New Mexico at

2140
01:35:48,460 --> 01:35:47,180
Air Force Base in New Mexico Holloman

2141
01:35:52,390 --> 01:35:48,470
Air Force Base

2142
01:35:54,040 --> 01:35:52,400
sergeant JP love it him and his Colonel

2143
01:35:55,630 --> 01:35:54,050
were going downrange to pick up some

2144
01:35:58,450 --> 01:35:55,640
parts of a missile that was fired a test

2145
01:36:00,210 --> 01:35:58,460
missile and the colonel heard the

2146
01:36:03,160 --> 01:36:00,220
sergeant scream he turned around he saw

2147
01:36:07,030 --> 01:36:03,170
something wrapped around the guy's leg

2148
01:36:08,380 --> 01:36:07,040
and pulling him into a craft and then of

2149
01:36:10,720 --> 01:36:08,390
course they arrested the colonel for

2150
01:36:14,080 --> 01:36:10,730
murder because they couldn't find a body

2151
01:36:15,010 --> 01:36:14,090
and they kind of didn't believe the

2152
01:36:17,350 --> 01:36:15,020
story but

2153
01:36:19,840 --> 01:36:17,360
days later sergeant Leavitt shows up

2154
01:36:21,700 --> 01:36:19,850
about a quarter of a mile from where he

2155
01:36:23,790 --> 01:36:21,710
was taken and he's in pretty much the

2156
01:36:27,070 --> 01:36:23,800
same condition as the other fellows

2157
01:36:31,270 --> 01:36:27,080
she's now and another thing we have no

2158
01:36:34,690 --> 01:36:31,280
report of any female of being done in

2159
01:36:36,730 --> 01:36:34,700
like this really and what is that with

2160
01:36:40,750 --> 01:36:36,740
cows are you familiar with how that

2161
01:36:45,340 --> 01:36:40,760
works if it cows or bulls mostly female

2162
01:36:48,930 --> 01:36:45,350
I think I saw I think I may have read

2163
01:36:51,220 --> 01:36:48,940
two cases where a bull was involved and

2164
01:36:55,000 --> 01:36:51,230
other than the unlike with the cow the

2165
01:36:56,890 --> 01:36:55,010
others were taken in the case of the

2166
01:36:59,980 --> 01:36:56,900
bull the penis and testicles were

2167
01:37:01,240 --> 01:36:59,990
removed but now that's another story

2168
01:37:04,330 --> 01:37:01,250
when you see some of these pictures

2169
01:37:06,520 --> 01:37:04,340
where somebody has actually removed the

2170
01:37:09,130 --> 01:37:06,530
utters without damaging the stomach's of

2171
01:37:11,470 --> 01:37:09,140
that cow that's pretty much impossible

2172
01:37:15,940 --> 01:37:11,480
it's only like a quarter of an inch of

2173
01:37:19,810 --> 01:37:15,950
skin between the the outside of the

2174
01:37:21,820 --> 01:37:19,820
utter skin and the inside which the next

2175
01:37:25,960 --> 01:37:21,830
thing they would it would be the would

2176
01:37:29,620 --> 01:37:25,970
be the one of the one of the cow

2177
01:37:31,630 --> 01:37:29,630
stomachs I mean we we talked to some

2178
01:37:33,070 --> 01:37:31,640
vets and they said hey there is no way

2179
01:37:35,320 --> 01:37:33,080
you're going to remove the utters or the

2180
01:37:39,010 --> 01:37:35,330
whole sack of utters without damaging

2181
01:37:41,200 --> 01:37:39,020
the stomachs he said nobody's that

2182
01:37:42,910 --> 01:37:41,210
precise I mean you're using a scalpel

2183
01:37:46,000 --> 01:37:42,920
well these cuts aren't being made with

2184
01:37:47,980 --> 01:37:46,010
scalpel these these things are cut clean

2185
01:37:50,530 --> 01:37:47,990
they're that they don't even show signs

2186
01:37:51,820 --> 01:37:50,540
of being cauterized I mean when you

2187
01:37:53,350 --> 01:37:51,830
cauterize something there's always a

2188
01:37:54,880 --> 01:37:53,360
burn mark I mean even if they work

2189
01:37:56,110 --> 01:37:54,890
authorizing something on your finger you

2190
01:37:58,210 --> 01:37:56,120
would see the cut and then you would see

2191
01:38:00,180 --> 01:37:58,220
the closure and you see a little dark

2192
01:38:03,340 --> 01:38:00,190
spot around it well that's from the heat

2193
01:38:04,690 --> 01:38:03,350
well these things show no heat so what

2194
01:38:07,120 --> 01:38:04,700
do they use it we don't have anything

2195
01:38:11,040 --> 01:38:07,130
like that and is it the same for the

2196
01:38:16,690 --> 01:38:14,290
totally amazing so anyway before we move

2197
01:38:20,820 --> 01:38:16,700
on if anyone wants to give us a ring and

2198
01:38:24,430 --> 01:38:20,830
talk to our guest tonight that's 603 967

2199
01:38:29,740 --> 01:38:24,440
403 oh you're welcome to call it

2200
01:38:32,500 --> 01:38:29,750
pardon me uh and in these these cases

2201
01:38:34,980 --> 01:38:32,510
are they as there anything that can tie

2202
01:38:39,670 --> 01:38:34,990
any of them together any similarities

2203
01:38:42,220 --> 01:38:39,680
between say the victims or anything that

2204
01:38:43,960 --> 01:38:42,230
at all that makes any type of sense

2205
01:38:47,500 --> 01:38:43,970
where there is some type of connection

2206
01:38:50,410 --> 01:38:47,510
the only Kasai the condition of the body

2207
01:38:52,420 --> 01:38:50,420
or the carcass the only thing that kind

2208
01:38:54,580 --> 01:38:52,430
of ties them all together is that

2209
01:38:57,790 --> 01:38:54,590
they're in very remote areas when it

2210
01:39:01,390 --> 01:38:57,800
happens hmm the sergeant he you know

2211
01:39:03,070 --> 01:39:01,400
he's in the desert the the guy in Brazil

2212
01:39:05,680 --> 01:39:03,080
he's on an island in the middle of a

2213
01:39:08,110 --> 01:39:05,690
man-made waterway some cattle have been

2214
01:39:10,630 --> 01:39:08,120
found up on high ranges in high mountain

2215
01:39:12,040 --> 01:39:10,640
areas where you know people don't even

2216
01:39:13,210 --> 01:39:12,050
go up to check on the cattle I mean they

2217
01:39:14,410 --> 01:39:13,220
just turn them loose for the feeding

2218
01:39:15,940 --> 01:39:14,420
season or whatever and then they'll

2219
01:39:19,660 --> 01:39:15,950
round them up come spring or whatever

2220
01:39:22,110 --> 01:39:19,670
and these these guys are you know

2221
01:39:24,610 --> 01:39:22,120
they're out in the middle of nowhere and

2222
01:39:26,530 --> 01:39:24,620
there have been ranchers that have been

2223
01:39:30,430 --> 01:39:26,540
had cattle mutilated six or seven times

2224
01:39:33,910 --> 01:39:30,440
on the same ranch well one guy had a cow

2225
01:39:35,470 --> 01:39:33,920
mutilated 50 feet from the barn door no

2226
01:39:36,700 --> 01:39:35,480
never saw or heard anything just went

2227
01:39:40,390 --> 01:39:36,710
out that morning and there laid the cow

2228
01:39:42,400 --> 01:39:40,400
right I've heard of some similar things

2229
01:39:46,390 --> 01:39:42,410
to that like on the skinwalker ranch and

2230
01:39:49,120 --> 01:39:46,400
stuff now when we were when I first

2231
01:39:50,980 --> 01:39:49,130
asked you that question what I meant was

2232
01:39:53,260 --> 01:39:50,990
not the cows was there anything that

2233
01:39:56,380 --> 01:39:53,270
could connect the people together and

2234
01:39:58,390 --> 01:39:56,390
but now you answer that that calls on

2235
01:40:03,490 --> 01:39:58,400
again I think I'm going to dare try this

2236
01:40:04,960 --> 01:40:03,500
so hello caller can you hear me yep okay

2237
01:40:08,950 --> 01:40:04,970
go ahead say your name where you calling

2238
01:40:10,510 --> 01:40:08,960
from John Tackett Columbus Ohio hi John

2239
01:40:12,940 --> 01:40:10,520
how are you yeah how you got a night

2240
01:40:14,890 --> 01:40:12,950
Martin I'm doing good what's your

2241
01:40:22,410 --> 01:40:14,900
question for the guest tonight my

2242
01:40:25,840 --> 01:40:22,420
question is what actual specific visual

2243
01:40:27,670 --> 01:40:25,850
is the most common visual you fo you

2244
01:40:30,220 --> 01:40:27,680
actually see because you made a comment

2245
01:40:32,710 --> 01:40:30,230
earlier that discs are not really as

2246
01:40:34,540 --> 01:40:32,720
happening as they were so what would

2247
01:40:36,130 --> 01:40:34,550
your perspective be on the most common

2248
01:40:38,200 --> 01:40:36,140
visual sighting of a UFO

2249
01:40:40,570 --> 01:40:38,210
what's a shape

2250
01:40:42,930 --> 01:40:40,580
the most common visual is I'm going to

2251
01:40:48,570 --> 01:40:42,940
split between two because they're almost

2252
01:40:50,950 --> 01:40:48,580
1 for one is the triangle and the orb

2253
01:40:52,209 --> 01:40:50,960
okay so if you are what now what do you

2254
01:40:54,459 --> 01:40:52,219
think the orb is you think that's

2255
01:40:58,360 --> 01:40:54,469
necessarily like that would would be our

2256
01:41:01,870 --> 01:40:58,370
like a example of like of our you know

2257
01:41:04,420 --> 01:41:01,880
robotic planes we have I just found I'm

2258
01:41:06,880 --> 01:41:04,430
talking about yeah I I know it's talking

2259
01:41:09,310 --> 01:41:06,890
about but these orbs have been seen they

2260
01:41:12,160 --> 01:41:09,320
first came into visual range and

2261
01:41:16,630 --> 01:41:12,170
photographic range during World War two

2262
01:41:19,330 --> 01:41:16,640
I know yeah that Poland by 5 yep and

2263
01:41:21,790 --> 01:41:19,340
then they kind of disappeared after the

2264
01:41:24,430 --> 01:41:21,800
war and nothing was really seen of them

2265
01:41:26,110 --> 01:41:24,440
again until the late 50s and they were

2266
01:41:28,870 --> 01:41:26,120
very sporadic there wasn't many of them

2267
01:41:29,979 --> 01:41:28,880
seen I think somebody did research one

2268
01:41:32,290 --> 01:41:29,989
time where they came up with about a

2269
01:41:36,370 --> 01:41:32,300
hundred reports in five years of an orb

2270
01:41:40,240 --> 01:41:36,380
now I'll get eight to ten reports a

2271
01:41:42,610 --> 01:41:40,250
month of an orb okay and how many then

2272
01:41:44,880 --> 01:41:42,620
now here's some of the theories some

2273
01:41:48,640 --> 01:41:44,890
people think that they are Scout ships

2274
01:41:49,990 --> 01:41:48,650
some people think that they are taking

2275
01:41:53,260 --> 01:41:50,000
samples because there are a lot of

2276
01:41:56,860 --> 01:41:53,270
reports where an orb is seen it may it

2277
01:41:59,320 --> 01:41:56,870
may be a large herb small orbs will exit

2278
01:42:01,060 --> 01:41:59,330
the larger orb and they will those

2279
01:42:04,030 --> 01:42:01,070
smaller orbs will drop to the ground

2280
01:42:06,700 --> 01:42:04,040
they will disappear where I seen again

2281
01:42:08,170 --> 01:42:06,710
and then maybe 10 15 minutes later

2282
01:42:11,740 --> 01:42:08,180
they'll come out of wherever they were

2283
01:42:15,190 --> 01:42:11,750
and go straight up you know I'll in my

2284
01:42:19,180 --> 01:42:15,200
perspective on on those orbs which is

2285
01:42:21,550 --> 01:42:19,190
drunk this we know in our society does

2286
01:42:24,670 --> 01:42:21,560
that make cell a yeah and it could be I

2287
01:42:27,010 --> 01:42:24,680
mean it could be but I I guess the the

2288
01:42:30,820 --> 01:42:27,020
part that always quizzes me about these

2289
01:42:32,830 --> 01:42:30,830
orbs is that there was a case in Oregon

2290
01:42:34,900 --> 01:42:32,840
not too long ago I believe is uh last

2291
01:42:38,770 --> 01:42:34,910
year the year before and a matter of

2292
01:42:40,690 --> 01:42:38,780
fact was a MUFON case and the gentleman

2293
01:42:42,610 --> 01:42:40,700
was out cutting his lawn can't work

2294
01:42:44,050 --> 01:42:42,620
anymore he has epilepsy pretty bad so

2295
01:42:45,610 --> 01:42:44,060
he's out cutting his lawn he lives on a

2296
01:42:48,220 --> 01:42:45,620
one-way street that has a turn around at

2297
01:42:50,800 --> 01:42:48,230
the end at the end of his street there's

2298
01:42:52,089 --> 01:42:50,810
a opposite to turn around it's at East T

2299
01:42:53,709 --> 01:42:52,099
intersection on the other side

2300
01:42:56,350 --> 01:42:53,719
t-intersections offense in the field and

2301
01:42:58,089 --> 01:42:56,360
a clump of trees perform he sees an

2302
01:43:00,640 --> 01:42:58,099
object go behind the farm which he

2303
01:43:03,040 --> 01:43:00,650
describes saucer-shaped it goes by the

2304
01:43:07,060 --> 01:43:03,050
trees he can't see it anymore next thing

2305
01:43:08,979 --> 01:43:07,070
you know he says the ship craft it goes

2306
01:43:11,919 --> 01:43:08,989
back up and disappears into the sky very

2307
01:43:15,399 --> 01:43:11,929
fast out from behind the trees comes an

2308
01:43:18,760 --> 01:43:15,409
orb the spot the size of a large beach

2309
01:43:20,640 --> 01:43:18,770
ball comes down the field crosses over

2310
01:43:23,649 --> 01:43:20,650
top of the fence comes up the street

2311
01:43:25,300 --> 01:43:23,659
goes right past in to the point where he

2312
01:43:26,620 --> 01:43:25,310
can touch it the dogs in the

2313
01:43:28,149 --> 01:43:26,630
neighborhood which are normally quiet

2314
01:43:29,530 --> 01:43:28,159
and one German Shepherd that's never

2315
01:43:32,410 --> 01:43:29,540
even barked a day in his life probably

2316
01:43:34,300 --> 01:43:32,420
he says is trying to rip apart to get

2317
01:43:37,060 --> 01:43:34,310
out of the house his dog is going

2318
01:43:40,560 --> 01:43:37,070
bananas the thing passes him as he looks

2319
01:43:44,500 --> 01:43:40,570
at it he said it's actually like

2320
01:43:47,169 --> 01:43:44,510
translucent but inside it's a head-on

2321
01:43:49,600 --> 01:43:47,179
you might I had a buddy of mine see one

2322
01:43:52,899 --> 01:43:49,610
and it looked like a [\h__\h] wizard

2323
01:43:55,660 --> 01:43:52,909
balloon from a different you almost

2324
01:43:59,260 --> 01:43:55,670
every throat it was also similar to a

2325
01:44:00,580 --> 01:43:59,270
mirror yeah yep that's why you described

2326
01:44:01,750 --> 01:44:00,590
this because he said it was almost like

2327
01:44:03,010 --> 01:44:01,760
looking in a mirror with something

2328
01:44:06,040 --> 01:44:03,020
moving around inside like different

2329
01:44:09,669 --> 01:44:06,050
colors now the thing stops on top of a

2330
01:44:11,379 --> 01:44:09,679
sewer plate and all kind of start flying

2331
01:44:13,359 --> 01:44:11,389
off the sewer plate and then it picks

2332
01:44:15,069 --> 01:44:13,369
itself up in about four or five foot off

2333
01:44:17,530 --> 01:44:15,079
the ground goes across the street and

2334
01:44:19,209 --> 01:44:17,540
attaches itself to a pole with an

2335
01:44:20,680 --> 01:44:19,219
electric pole pole that generates

2336
01:44:21,910 --> 01:44:20,690
electric brings the electric into those

2337
01:44:25,000 --> 01:44:21,920
homes there's only a few homes on the

2338
01:44:27,640 --> 01:44:25,010
street it detaches self it starts to go

2339
01:44:29,379 --> 01:44:27,650
down well I'm at one back hold on now

2340
01:44:31,870 --> 01:44:29,389
when they set yourself to actual pole

2341
01:44:34,990 --> 01:44:31,880
did anybody in the area report any kind

2342
01:44:36,370 --> 01:44:35,000
of power issues yes they had there was a

2343
01:44:37,750 --> 01:44:36,380
drop in power but nothing went off I

2344
01:44:38,919 --> 01:44:37,760
mean you know in other words a light

2345
01:44:41,760 --> 01:44:38,929
dimmed like you know you're going to

2346
01:44:44,080 --> 01:44:41,770
lose power right everything dropped down

2347
01:44:46,899 --> 01:44:44,090
by this time there's neighbors outside

2348
01:44:48,640 --> 01:44:46,909
they see it there's one lady who's on

2349
01:44:50,560 --> 01:44:48,650
her porch next door to him screaming him

2350
01:44:52,750 --> 01:44:50,570
to get away and he's just dumbfounded he

2351
01:44:54,879 --> 01:44:52,760
just stand there looking at it and it

2352
01:44:56,979 --> 01:44:54,889
comes back off the pole goes back over

2353
01:44:58,439 --> 01:44:56,989
to the plate raises up four or five foot

2354
01:45:02,799 --> 01:44:58,449
in the ground and just

2355
01:45:05,750 --> 01:45:02,809
vaporizes gone interesting so it's

2356
01:45:11,330 --> 01:45:05,760
almost like I get with more Hansen

2357
01:45:14,270 --> 01:45:11,340
bang man mess that's all all total there

2358
01:45:16,040 --> 01:45:14,280
were four witnesses that saw the same

2359
01:45:18,350 --> 01:45:16,050
thing interesting

2360
01:45:22,160 --> 01:45:18,360
well John Hale in the house was sick for

2361
01:45:24,740 --> 01:45:22,170
four days vomiting Wow John thanks for

2362
01:45:28,850 --> 01:45:24,750
calling in okay thanks Martin hey you're

2363
01:45:34,520 --> 01:45:31,280
wow that's quite the sighting a you know

2364
01:45:37,070 --> 01:45:34,530
we had a and it's fine that that we're

2365
01:45:40,400 --> 01:45:37,080
back on UFOs but someone wanted to ask

2366
01:45:43,460 --> 01:45:40,410
you a question in regards to what the

2367
01:45:45,260 --> 01:45:43,470
conversation was a minute ago and of the

2368
01:45:49,310 --> 01:45:45,270
human mutilations to the common

2369
01:45:51,830 --> 01:45:49,320
phenomena of blackhawk helicopters likes

2370
01:45:54,560 --> 01:45:51,840
in the sky that while there have been

2371
01:45:57,050 --> 01:45:54,570
two reports where black helicopters were

2372
01:45:59,270 --> 01:45:57,060
seen in the area not overhead but in the

2373
01:46:01,960 --> 01:45:59,280
area and when I say in the area within a

2374
01:46:04,850 --> 01:46:01,970
mile of where the mutilation was found

2375
01:46:07,700 --> 01:46:04,860
yeah well and that was both cattle and

2376
01:46:11,270 --> 01:46:07,710
human now when we were talking earlier

2377
01:46:13,250 --> 01:46:11,280
and I asked what the connections were it

2378
01:46:15,710 --> 01:46:13,260
sounded like you started speaking about

2379
01:46:17,300 --> 01:46:15,720
the cattle mutilations and who and you

2380
01:46:18,800 --> 01:46:17,310
said they were you know left way out

2381
01:46:21,260 --> 01:46:18,810
remotely and stuff like that I was

2382
01:46:23,570 --> 01:46:21,270
asking about the human mutilations were

2383
01:46:25,970 --> 01:46:23,580
there any is there anything that connect

2384
01:46:28,370 --> 01:46:25,980
could connect one to another or any

2385
01:46:33,950 --> 01:46:28,380
similarities that you're aware of other

2386
01:46:36,980 --> 01:46:33,960
than the wounds no that's it yep amazing

2387
01:46:39,380 --> 01:46:36,990
now other people that are research are

2388
01:46:41,090 --> 01:46:39,390
you one of the few people researching

2389
01:46:43,250 --> 01:46:41,100
this or are other people involved I

2390
01:46:45,560 --> 01:46:43,260
pretty much think I'm the only one that

2391
01:46:50,770 --> 01:46:45,570
does it anymore

2392
01:46:53,030 --> 01:46:50,780
and you said this started back in 1956

2393
01:46:56,210 --> 01:46:53,040
actual next yeah that's when cases

2394
01:46:57,890 --> 01:46:56,220
started popping up that bodies were

2395
01:47:01,880 --> 01:46:57,900
being found with strange markings and

2396
01:47:04,010 --> 01:47:01,890
missing parts yeah an 11 known in the US

2397
01:47:06,620 --> 01:47:04,020
and you started to say you were unsure

2398
01:47:09,050 --> 01:47:06,630
about other countries do you know I mean

2399
01:47:11,390 --> 01:47:09,060
England I believe you said other England

2400
01:47:13,730 --> 01:47:11,400
in England there researcher over there

2401
01:47:17,330 --> 01:47:13,740
Richard Hall has been investigating

2402
01:47:19,610 --> 01:47:17,340
these for probably a lot longer than I

2403
01:47:22,760 --> 01:47:19,620
have and you know he's got

2404
01:47:25,220 --> 01:47:22,770
some really great stuff going on over

2405
01:47:26,720 --> 01:47:25,230
there I'm familiar with with most of his

2406
01:47:28,160 --> 01:47:26,730
stuff but you know he's got a lot of

2407
01:47:30,050 --> 01:47:28,170
stuff he's holding back yet that he's

2408
01:47:31,940 --> 01:47:30,060
got to verify and that's the biggest

2409
01:47:33,350 --> 01:47:31,950
thing with these cases you got to verify

2410
01:47:36,290 --> 01:47:33,360
them before you go talking about them

2411
01:47:37,790 --> 01:47:36,300
because you know they're so strange

2412
01:47:40,010 --> 01:47:37,800
they're almost you almost think that

2413
01:47:41,900 --> 01:47:40,020
somebody just sat there made them up but

2414
01:47:43,520 --> 01:47:41,910
you know the cases that have come

2415
01:47:45,200 --> 01:47:43,530
forward that you know like the autopsy

2416
01:47:47,710 --> 01:47:45,210
reports we can read you know I had the

2417
01:47:51,200 --> 01:47:47,720
claw had to get the one from Brazil uh

2418
01:47:53,840 --> 01:47:51,210
translated from the you know their

2419
01:47:59,750 --> 01:47:53,850
language to us but it was worth 250

2420
01:48:03,410 --> 01:47:59,760
bucks excuse me and not people speak

2421
01:48:06,230 --> 01:48:03,420
Portuguese around my area oh yeah so the

2422
01:48:08,990 --> 01:48:06,240
is there anything like a radiation or

2423
01:48:11,510 --> 01:48:09,000
anything like that any exposure any

2424
01:48:17,330 --> 01:48:11,520
other dope unusual things no radiation

2425
01:48:20,060 --> 01:48:17,340
exposure no burns no no um how I say

2426
01:48:22,460 --> 01:48:20,070
have damage done to the body

2427
01:48:23,510 --> 01:48:22,470
you know like with an axe or a sharp

2428
01:48:26,300 --> 01:48:23,520
knife or anything like that

2429
01:48:28,850 --> 01:48:26,310
everything is precision they're all done

2430
01:48:32,420 --> 01:48:28,860
the same way done in the same way same

2431
01:48:34,640 --> 01:48:32,430
parts are taken not much body found and

2432
01:48:38,120 --> 01:48:34,650
you know it's just it's just very

2433
01:48:41,840 --> 01:48:38,130
strange and approximately how long is

2434
01:48:46,010 --> 01:48:41,850
the body of like left where ever datas

2435
01:48:50,210 --> 01:48:46,020
and of these indoor-outdoor where are

2436
01:48:53,030 --> 01:48:50,220
they found most outdoor uh the the only

2437
01:48:56,780 --> 01:48:53,040
one I know that was indoor was the Cairo

2438
01:48:58,190 --> 01:48:56,790
case the others were all outdoors bliss

2439
01:49:02,030 --> 01:48:58,200
Idaho that was out in the middle of

2440
01:49:03,680 --> 01:49:02,040
nowhere which is strange because and

2441
01:49:05,420 --> 01:49:03,690
when I first read that report it kind of

2442
01:49:07,580 --> 01:49:05,430
took me to Todd seats because when cease

2443
01:49:08,120 --> 01:49:07,590
was found the area where he lives and

2444
01:49:09,950 --> 01:49:08,130
we've been there

2445
01:49:11,990 --> 01:49:09,960
I mean it's so Rocky that well you know

2446
01:49:14,420 --> 01:49:12,000
I was wearing pretty heavy heavy boots

2447
01:49:16,730 --> 01:49:14,430
and those rocks were hurt my feet I mean

2448
01:49:19,550 --> 01:49:16,740
it's just unbelievable how rocky that

2449
01:49:22,400 --> 01:49:19,560
area is he was found in his socks

2450
01:49:25,970 --> 01:49:22,410
and his feet were not damaged at all

2451
01:49:27,410 --> 01:49:25,980
there was no is his feet ankles top

2452
01:49:29,210 --> 01:49:27,420
bottom were unremarkable there was no

2453
01:49:30,610 --> 01:49:29,220
damage no scratches no bruises no

2454
01:49:33,740 --> 01:49:30,620
nothing

2455
01:49:36,920 --> 01:49:33,750
Bobby get there that's really weird

2456
01:49:39,830 --> 01:49:36,930
yeah and then to me that there was

2457
01:49:43,700 --> 01:49:39,840
another and maybe I'm confusing another

2458
01:49:46,220 --> 01:49:43,710
case but that people saw like someone

2459
01:49:49,280 --> 01:49:46,230
the same thing like lifted up into a

2460
01:49:51,470 --> 01:49:49,290
craft but the guy was really in rough

2461
01:49:53,660 --> 01:49:51,480
shape when he was found is that is that

2462
01:49:55,640 --> 01:49:53,670
anything sounds familiar to you at the

2463
01:49:58,280 --> 01:49:55,650
same case it is the same case yeah

2464
01:50:00,920 --> 01:49:58,290
that's Patsy's case yeah see and

2465
01:50:03,680 --> 01:50:00,930
everybody's conception of this is that a

2466
01:50:05,000 --> 01:50:03,690
UFO picked him up took him up and then

2467
01:50:06,620 --> 01:50:05,010
you know day later dropped him off in

2468
01:50:09,740 --> 01:50:06,630
the back you know out in the backcountry

2469
01:50:12,200 --> 01:50:09,750
but you know although we have a report

2470
01:50:14,960 --> 01:50:12,210
that the guy's the fisherman and the

2471
01:50:16,460 --> 01:50:14,970
farmer see something like a man being

2472
01:50:17,620 --> 01:50:16,470
pulled up into a craft above the

2473
01:50:20,870 --> 01:50:17,630
powerlines

2474
01:50:22,490 --> 01:50:20,880
dressed in his underwear which had a

2475
01:50:24,740 --> 01:50:22,500
distance from where the river is to

2476
01:50:26,780 --> 01:50:24,750
where he was seen and you know it's like

2477
01:50:33,020 --> 01:50:26,790
come out of his driveway and across the

2478
01:50:34,640 --> 01:50:33,030
road you're at the river uh you have at

2479
01:50:36,320 --> 01:50:34,650
that distance you know a guy in his

2480
01:50:37,760 --> 01:50:36,330
shorts and a t-shirt with socks on would

2481
01:50:41,300 --> 01:50:37,770
look like a guy in his underwear I guess

2482
01:50:44,330 --> 01:50:41,310
and that's how he was found cutoff jeans

2483
01:50:46,520 --> 01:50:44,340
t-shirt and socks that was it yeah Wow

2484
01:50:50,420 --> 01:50:46,530
now you mentioned in the very beginning

2485
01:50:55,580 --> 01:50:50,430
of the podcast that or the live show

2486
01:50:58,040 --> 01:50:55,590
that is that you had 10 separate

2487
01:51:01,190 --> 01:50:58,050
chapters or whatever of of this

2488
01:51:02,570 --> 01:51:01,200
organization and some in Europe are you

2489
01:51:04,910 --> 01:51:02,580
like in touch with these people

2490
01:51:07,940 --> 01:51:04,920
constantly or does everyone work on

2491
01:51:11,960 --> 01:51:07,950
their own no we're in constant contact

2492
01:51:13,910 --> 01:51:11,970
with everybody they know what I'm doing

2493
01:51:16,070 --> 01:51:13,920
I know what they're doing matter of fact

2494
01:51:22,280 --> 01:51:16,080
that case that you were talking about

2495
01:51:26,410 --> 01:51:22,290
with Alejandro the ham operator and the

2496
01:51:29,360 --> 01:51:26,420
airline pilot that was a MUFON Utah case

2497
01:51:32,980 --> 01:51:29,370
right and the girl investigated that

2498
01:51:38,120 --> 01:51:32,990
Erika Luke's is the person that runs my

2499
01:51:42,170 --> 01:51:38,130
you for cop branch in Utah Oh 13s of

2500
01:51:43,610 --> 01:51:42,180
just recently yeah oh okay good yeah I

2501
01:51:47,180 --> 01:51:43,620
like Erika she's very nice

2502
01:51:49,850 --> 01:51:47,190
she's uh she's a past guest on the show

2503
01:51:52,189 --> 01:51:49,860
yeah she'sshe's quite a lady huh yeah

2504
01:51:56,689 --> 01:51:52,199
she joined us about believe it's three

2505
01:51:59,209 --> 01:51:56,699
weeks now that's just about right yeah

2506
01:52:01,550 --> 01:51:59,219
we have been playing phone tag because I

2507
01:52:05,570 --> 01:52:01,560
wanted to find out what exactly

2508
01:52:10,160 --> 01:52:05,580
transpired but so I'm sure she'll share

2509
01:52:11,780 --> 01:52:10,170
some of that with me but yes Wow well

2510
01:52:15,290 --> 01:52:11,790
you know we're getting near the end of

2511
01:52:17,390 --> 01:52:15,300
the show and so we have a maybe five or

2512
01:52:21,020 --> 01:52:17,400
five minutes or so left four or five

2513
01:52:25,990 --> 01:52:21,030
minutes and do you actually have a

2514
01:52:32,390 --> 01:52:26,000
website yes oh and yeah it's a four-top

2515
01:52:34,669 --> 01:52:32,400
you for Capcom it's a UFO our Co P com

2516
01:52:36,439 --> 01:52:34,679
no I mean do you have a personal website

2517
01:52:37,910 --> 01:52:36,449
or is that can you just be found on that

2518
01:52:40,160 --> 01:52:37,920
one

2519
01:52:42,140 --> 01:52:40,170
oh no I'm also on Facebook we have like

2520
01:52:43,970 --> 01:52:42,150
three pages on Facebook we have au port

2521
01:52:47,629 --> 01:52:43,980
cop page we have UFO research center

2522
01:52:49,879 --> 01:52:47,639
Pennsylvania page we have a jar page I

2523
01:52:52,570 --> 01:52:49,889
am the editor of jar magazine which is a

2524
01:52:57,350 --> 01:52:52,580
Journal of abnormal abduction research

2525
01:53:01,760 --> 01:52:57,360
and then I have a personal page also now

2526
01:53:04,250 --> 01:53:01,770
are you are you a retired and you just

2527
01:53:07,729 --> 01:53:04,260
do all this now like this sounds like a

2528
01:53:09,290 --> 01:53:07,739
full-time job it is a full-time job when

2529
01:53:11,870 --> 01:53:09,300
I'm done with you I'll be up here in my

2530
01:53:13,700 --> 01:53:11,880
office till about 4:00 a.m. oh I'll grab

2531
01:53:20,180 --> 01:53:13,710
six hours of sleep and I'll be back at

2532
01:53:22,280 --> 01:53:20,190
it Wow and I retire in 2013 uh-huh

2533
01:53:25,640 --> 01:53:22,290
and then basically this is taking your

2534
01:53:26,990 --> 01:53:25,650
time now we're one more question along

2535
01:53:29,570 --> 01:53:27,000
these lines what's the furthest away

2536
01:53:32,090 --> 01:53:29,580
that the the farther set you will travel

2537
01:53:35,330 --> 01:53:32,100
for a case does it depend on what the

2538
01:53:37,040 --> 01:53:35,340
case is not not really I mean if

2539
01:53:38,330 --> 01:53:37,050
somebody needs are like I said before if

2540
01:53:39,740 --> 01:53:38,340
anybody needs our help whether it's

2541
01:53:42,470 --> 01:53:39,750
something I can do here in the office or

2542
01:53:44,689 --> 01:53:42,480
through the other groups or if they

2543
01:53:46,640 --> 01:53:44,699
require you know but if they need that

2544
01:53:48,320 --> 01:53:46,650
mobile unit on the site of what they

2545
01:53:49,610 --> 01:53:48,330
think they have let's a cattle

2546
01:53:52,700 --> 01:53:49,620
mutilation whatever or whatever that

2547
01:53:55,760 --> 01:53:52,710
whatever comes up if it's within

2548
01:53:57,110 --> 01:53:55,770
Pennsylvania no problem I can be it

2549
01:53:58,310 --> 01:53:57,120
either into Pennsylvania within five

2550
01:53:59,670 --> 01:53:58,320
hours or less

2551
01:54:01,860 --> 01:53:59,680
way less

2552
01:54:04,230 --> 01:54:01,870
and if it's like say I'm going out to

2553
01:54:05,730 --> 01:54:04,240
Missouri to investigate something as

2554
01:54:06,960 --> 01:54:05,740
long as they can help with the gas and

2555
01:54:09,630 --> 01:54:06,970
tolls I'm on my way

2556
01:54:14,610 --> 01:54:09,640
I see now do you have pictures of this

2557
01:54:16,230 --> 01:54:14,620
rig we just took the old ones down the

2558
01:54:21,870 --> 01:54:16,240
new pictures of the new we just bought a

2559
01:54:22,980 --> 01:54:21,880
2016 Ford Transit and and it's something

2560
01:54:29,640 --> 01:54:22,990
we always won because the other was a

2561
01:54:31,230 --> 01:54:29,650
afford it was a 2012 but it was a little

2562
01:54:33,030 --> 01:54:31,240
low top this one we can walk around and

2563
01:54:34,500 --> 01:54:33,040
inside we have a lot more shelving in it

2564
01:54:36,630 --> 01:54:34,510
we just got it back from those folks

2565
01:54:38,430 --> 01:54:36,640
yesterday and but last three days now

2566
01:54:40,230 --> 01:54:38,440
I've been shuffling equipment in and out

2567
01:54:42,960 --> 01:54:40,240
and in now we'll have everything ready

2568
01:54:45,090 --> 01:54:42,970
to roll in the next by the end of this

2569
01:54:46,410 --> 01:54:45,100
week everything will be finished the

2570
01:54:48,630 --> 01:54:46,420
only thing that's not won't be finished

2571
01:54:50,880 --> 01:54:48,640
for two weeks is the radio people have

2572
01:54:52,140 --> 01:54:50,890
to put all radios back in because we're

2573
01:54:53,820 --> 01:54:52,150
going to do a different setup this time

2574
01:54:55,730 --> 01:54:53,830
we're going to put radios in a console

2575
01:54:57,750 --> 01:54:55,740
between the seats just like a police car

2576
01:54:59,520 --> 01:54:57,760
instead of hanging them off the ceiling

2577
01:55:02,880 --> 01:54:59,530
and all that stuff yeah almost like

2578
01:55:04,320 --> 01:55:02,890
storm chasers in a way oh we make them

2579
01:55:07,800 --> 01:55:04,330
look sick we got more equipment than

2580
01:55:10,770 --> 01:55:07,810
they awesome well this has been a lot of

2581
01:55:15,170 --> 01:55:10,780
fun I've really enjoyed speaking you to

2582
01:55:18,050 --> 01:55:15,180
you tonight and my pleasure yes and so

2583
01:55:21,450 --> 01:55:18,060
anyone out there that would like to

2584
01:55:23,790 --> 01:55:21,460
contact you for a UFO report is it

2585
01:55:25,620 --> 01:55:23,800
instead of going to the other two that

2586
01:55:28,710 --> 01:55:25,630
you hear so much about they're welcome

2587
01:55:29,400 --> 01:55:28,720
to contact you yeah they can contact me

2588
01:55:30,810 --> 01:55:29,410
about anything

2589
01:55:32,070 --> 01:55:30,820
whether it's a question they want

2590
01:55:33,660 --> 01:55:32,080
answered or if there's something I can

2591
01:55:36,000 --> 01:55:33,670
find in my database or they may have a

2592
01:55:39,030 --> 01:55:36,010
photograph they want us to look at we

2593
01:55:40,710 --> 01:55:39,040
use Photoshop cm s7 to go over our

2594
01:55:44,490 --> 01:55:40,720
photographs and a couple other programs

2595
01:55:48,210 --> 01:55:44,500
we have or they they have a case that

2596
01:55:49,470 --> 01:55:48,220
they won't look that the only thing I

2597
01:55:50,820 --> 01:55:49,480
won't do is I won't interfere if

2598
01:55:53,730 --> 01:55:50,830
somebody else is investigating the case

2599
01:55:55,320 --> 01:55:53,740
yeah that makes sense yeah I just I just

2600
01:55:58,290 --> 01:55:55,330
don't do that I mean you know it's just

2601
01:56:02,550 --> 01:55:58,300
bad that's just bad jiju yeah but I get

2602
01:56:04,200 --> 01:56:02,560
that all right well it's time to go and

2603
01:56:06,180 --> 01:56:04,210
I want to thank you so much it's been a

2604
01:56:09,180 --> 01:56:06,190
real pleasure and I hope to talk to you

2605
01:56:11,670 --> 01:56:09,190
soon oh absolutely any time all right

2606
01:56:13,080 --> 01:56:11,680
you take care you too take care now

2607
01:56:16,140 --> 01:56:13,090
thanks bye-bye

2608
01:56:18,570 --> 01:56:16,150
all right everyone thanks so much for

2609
01:56:21,030 --> 01:56:18,580
listening and it's been a great show I

2610
01:56:22,350 --> 01:56:21,040
think and hope you enjoyed it and if

2611
01:56:24,419 --> 01:56:22,360
you're listening this fire you're either

2612
01:56:26,609 --> 01:56:24,429
listening live or you're listening on

2613
01:56:28,260 --> 01:56:26,619
the dark matter digital network or

2614
01:56:30,450 --> 01:56:28,270
you're a supporter of the show and

2615
01:56:32,820 --> 01:56:30,460
listening to the podcast remember you

2616
01:56:35,729 --> 01:56:32,830
can still donate doesn't matter what it

2617
01:56:37,620 --> 01:56:35,739
is for the buzz off for cancer for kids

2618
01:56:39,030 --> 01:56:37,630
that I did and yes I'm bald as a

2619
01:56:42,060 --> 01:56:39,040
cucumber you can check that out on

2620
01:56:44,609 --> 01:56:42,070
podcast UFO thanks for listening we have

2621
01:56:48,629 --> 01:56:44,619
the one and only Stanton T Friedman is

2622
01:56:51,030 --> 01:56:48,639
on next week and we'll be back then same